Jump to content

WH Bolt Handle vs Kahr (Differences?)


Recommended Posts

After having the bolt handle on my WH 1927a1 SA break, I ordered another one from gunpartscorp. After installing it, i started running into some issues with the bolt not charging all the way back to the spring buffer as it normally should. This is causing the bolt to slightly protrude preventing proper insertion of drum mag (I was able to get it in with a bit of force and a few colorful cusswords). Clearly this isn't the correct charging handle and i don't want to cause any damage to either the bolt or the firing pin as a result.

 

So a couple questions for the members here:

1. Am I crazy, or is there a difference between these two styles of charging handles? (Kahr & WH)

2. Any recommendations on where I can order the correct bolt handle?

3. Would it be a reasonable task to possibly machine this thing so that it works correctly? It seems that the slots that hold it in the upper reciever are a bit more "rounded" on the new bolt vs the original. I was thinkin if these were squared off it may fix the issue.

 

Any feedback or insight would be much welcomed. Pics attached.

 

 

pic 1 - old bolt handle & new bolt handle side by side

post-260254-0-08332800-1448217774_thumb.jpg

 

pic 2 - old bolt handle - bolt charges all the back to the buffer plate

post-260254-0-21522900-1448217778_thumb.jpg

 

pic 3 - old bolt handle - top view of upper

post-260254-0-46029800-1448217781_thumb.jpg

 

pic 4 - new bolt handle - bolt does not charge back to buffer plate

post-260254-0-36020700-1448217785_thumb.jpg

 

pic 5 - new bolt handle - top view of upper

post-260254-0-79861900-1448217788_thumb.jpg

Edited by eddielee
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Since you ordered your replacement from Numrich (gunpartscorp) that would be the correct one for your West Hurley since they were the manufacturer. The Kahr version is more rounded to mimic the original '21/'28's. I would try to run the charging handle in the receiver slot by itself to try to see where it is catching if you haven't already. Then add each part 1 x 1 to see where the problem is. It could be as little as a small inconsistency the could be remedied with some hand filing.

You can see what the Kahr one really looks like here:

http://www.machinegunboards.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=18499

 

There is also a link there to kahrs online store if you want to try one of theirs to see if it will work.

 

Jon

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks Jon. I did the 1x1 process and it seems that there's actually a few different points of contention with this "new" bolt handle.

 

1. Receiver slot - it seems like it might be getting caught up somehow due to the rounded edge in the slots that catch the upper receiver on the handle itself. This seems to be occuring as the bolt is pulled back. I also noticed that these notches are sized differently on the two handles, with the top being rounded off vs the squared style on the old handle.

 

2. The slot in the handle that holds the hammer in place is shaped differently on the new handle vs the old one, with less clearance at the top. It seems like this is causing the handle to push the bolt against the lower receiver causing it to get stuck.

 

I used a bit of JB weld on the old handle to piece it back together & reinstalled it after letting it dry, just for test comparison purposes. I wanted to confirm that the problem was indeed with the handle & not something else on the gun. After installing the old handle, the bolt pulled back flawlessly & i didn't have any issues whatsoever ( I didn't test fire it of course, so "flawless" in theory i guess).

 

After further inspection, I also noticed a few other things that are different when comparing the two handles.

- The sight notch in the top of the handle is much wider on the new vs old.

- The top of the handle has a bit of a rounder pitch on the new vs old.

- the bottom of the handle on the old is flat vs a rounder more polished bottom on the new

- the hammer slot is more oblong on the old vs the new

- the ridge under the "cheese grating" at the top of the handle on the new, is machined with a lower profile than the old.

- the cheese grating on the new is different on the new vs the old (much smaller bevels).

 

So the final conclusion here is that these handles are in fact completely different. Which brings me to my next question. Did Numerich manufacture different styles of bolt handles for these WH's?

 

I ask, because I'd much rather order the correct handle instead of trying to rig one that wasn't meant for this specific gun and at this point, I'm not even sure what I'm looking for.

 

Thanks in advance.

Edited by eddielee
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Mine is from 1990. And you may be on to something. I've seen one from the 70s(very low serial number) that actually had the cocking knob which had to be pulled up on to lock the bolt to the rear and pushed down on to release the bolt catch. Is this what yours does? If so, they may indeed be different.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yeah, mine does actually do that. AND I've dated this thing back to '75... The very first civi production run by Numrich. There's also a smalle/narrower hole just in front of where you insert the handle that is sized so that the handle can be pulled up in order to hold the bolt back.

 

I didn't realize that was a unique design to this specific production series. The mystery is slowly beginning to unravel itself now...

 

Now if I can only get my hands on a charging handle that was manufactured in the first 200 Numrich units from over 40 years ago... Oy.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks Bender I'll be putting in a call to them tomorrow. In the meantime I came across this older post for anyone else that might stroll through here with the same issue. Here's the TL;DR version: Apparently the different design is indeed specific to the VERY early runs of these and they're basically modified smg surplus parts.

http://www.machinegunboards.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=2355

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just thought I'd give an update here after chatting with the folks at Numrich. They did confirm that the charging handle for the very early production 1927a1's is indeed different from the later versions. The primary difference is that the handle is machined differently in order to accommodate the double notched "keyhole" slot, which allows for the bolt to be held open by pulling the handle up. This didn't function very well, so after the first run, they changed the UR design and as a result, made modification to the handle. The rep at Numerich said he's pretty sure he has an older handle in stock somewhere & that they were willing to exchange the incorrect one i purchased for it (even thought it's been a few months... very nice of them!).

 

So i'll be sending back the handle today with the hope that they can send back the correct one. Will update here when it comes in.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...

Just updating the thread with news that I received the new-used charging handle for Numerich. Worked like a charm & besides a few feed issues with the drum - fired flawlessly. I'm super stoked to have my .45 back in working order again.

 

So moral to the story - if you own an older production WH 1927a1 (1975) and are looking for replacement parts - make sure to clarify what year the weapon was manufactured when ordering, as the versions mfg'd in the late 70's & early 80's use a different upper receiver design then early production models.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share

×
×
  • Create New...