1armybrat Posted April 11, 2017 Report Share Posted April 11, 2017 New to the forum. I have a 02/07 license. A buddy has a Thompson that was approved with a plugged barrel and barrel welded to the receiver. This was approved in 1971 as deactivated.I am trying to figure out what good it is. Can it be reactivated as a pre -86 sample? Only value I see is you have a display gun that has a working bolt.Thank you in advance for your input Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wwiifirearms Posted April 11, 2017 Report Share Posted April 11, 2017 I've never seen that exact paperwork, but sounds like it could be a registered transferable DEWAT, in which case it could be reactivated as a transferable, civilian ownable, Machinegun by filing a form 1 or 2. Others may know more. Hopefully it has not been changing hands without being transferred. If the ATF can't clear it up, or it gets complicated, send me a message and I'll give you the name of a lawyer that is good at straightening out the registration status of guns. It could be worth a lot more than a dealer sample. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1armybrat Posted April 11, 2017 Author Report Share Posted April 11, 2017 Roger that. What trips me up on a fully transferable is the date being past 1968.The fellow that its registered to has just pasted and we are trying to do right by the widow on giving here a decent value on the gun Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bug Posted April 11, 2017 Report Share Posted April 11, 2017 Was he an 02/07? Black River Militaria would likely have info on the F 4539 and what it means in this case. I saw him at the creek this weekend so he may not be up to speed yet. Bubba would be my first call... Bob D BTW, good on you for helping her out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black River Militaria CII Posted April 11, 2017 Report Share Posted April 11, 2017 (edited) The first document is the transfer for the deactivated gun. This document is signed by the transferor and stamped approved. It is not the usual form for transfer of a DEWAT and is not marked at the bottom right as an F5. This document is not the original registration of the gun, in any case, and since ATF apparently approved it, it is just a transfer. If it was the original registration, the submission date would have to be prior to the end of the '68 Amnesty and dated no later than Dec. 1, 1968, the last day for submission.The middle document is merely a notification that it has been deactivated with the approval of ATF.The last document is the transferee ID and fingerprint form, the 4539. Fingerprints were done on the backside. These forms were done in duplicate and accompanied the transfer form and one came back with the approved form. Later on the ID information was added to the F1, F4 and F5.The gun can be transferred from the estate to a legal beneficiary and can transfer tax exempt. A non-beneficiary can file an F5 application for transfer to him from the estate.The gun is identified as a DEWAT and can be legally reactivated by a new registrant. It must be transferred out of the estate on an F5 to the new registrant, which is tax exempt since the gun is a DEWAT.The executor signs the transfer out from the estate and he must include a copy of his appointment as executor along with a death certificate. Info about the decedent is included on the transfer form.Hope this helps. Edited April 11, 2017 by Black River Militaria CII Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron_brock Posted April 11, 2017 Report Share Posted April 11, 2017 (edited) Sounds like another gun saved and the widow should be happy the gun has value! Keep us posted. Ron Edited April 11, 2017 by ron_brock Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black River Militaria CII Posted April 12, 2017 Report Share Posted April 12, 2017 (edited) The executor of the estate can call ATF and ask for a specialist, specifically Mr. Cutter, who is very competent. Request the registration status of the serial number of the gun you have. ATF may request that the executor write a letter concerning the guns with copies of the documents shown above.If the gun is in the registry, the NFRTR, and in the name of the decedent, then the executor can proceed with the appropriate paperwork to transfer the gun to a buyer or beneficiary. Edited April 13, 2017 by Black River Militaria CII Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1armybrat Posted April 12, 2017 Author Report Share Posted April 12, 2017 Excellent guidance. Thank you! I will update you guys on how it works out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalbert Posted April 13, 2017 Report Share Posted April 13, 2017 This is very similar to the paperwork for a Colt Thompson that was dewatted in 1970 in Chicago, and has since been sold and reactivated by another collector, and is transferable. From what I have seen on these two forms, if the letter contained all the appropriate information, it was approved by ATF, who added their stamp to the non-standard paperwork. David Albertdalbert@sturmgewehr.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1armybrat Posted April 14, 2017 Author Report Share Posted April 14, 2017 Time will tell. I have made an offer and it appears we will be moving forward with the transfer.The weld job is more then solid and will take a bit of work when the time is right.Thank you for the input,it is encouraging. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snipershot1944 Posted April 14, 2017 Report Share Posted April 14, 2017 How did the demilitarized it? Weld a rod in the barrel and pin it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1armybrat Posted May 2, 2017 Author Report Share Posted May 2, 2017 I will add pictures of the dewat work as soon as i can get them.Thank you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1armybrat Posted November 1, 2017 Author Report Share Posted November 1, 2017 To update : the transfer of this dewat did go through. They did had it on file. The atf wanted me to provide a separate letter confirming overall length as their records had no length at all.And they need clarification on the Status of the trust Closed or open. I did have to get a letter from the trust attorney specifying that all possessions belonged now to the widow. Thanks for your input. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zb39 Posted November 28, 2017 Report Share Posted November 28, 2017 anymore updates on this???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1armybrat Posted November 28, 2017 Author Report Share Posted November 28, 2017 I have sent the the form 2 in for reactivation but have not gotten the form 2 approval but it hasn't been enough time yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1armybrat Posted November 28, 2017 Author Report Share Posted November 28, 2017 the gun has been discussed in detail in this thread. Identifying How Much of this Gun is Colt and What Directi.. . in Thompson Submachine Gun Message BoardThank you for your interest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black River Militaria CII Posted December 2, 2017 Report Share Posted December 2, 2017 (edited) Just an FYI, a form 2 is a "notification" of specific FFL07 activity and is not an application of an "approval" of that activity. One ATF signed copy of the F2 will be returned to you for your records of the reactivation of the registered DEWAT. Edited December 2, 2017 by Black River Militaria CII Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1armybrat Posted December 5, 2017 Author Report Share Posted December 5, 2017 Understood. I have had them ask for more specific information and request I resubmitted the form 2 as it applied to a dealer sample.Being my 1st reactivation gun I am not sure whether it is C&R transferable. How is this determined? I have read through the post on this forum and a few on others.But still not sure. This gun was transfered to my 07/02 business from the estate on a form 5.When I go to sell it ,how do I know its C&R transferable?Is the advantage of the C&R transferable gun the savings of one $200. fee or is their more to it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wwiifirearms Posted December 5, 2017 Report Share Posted December 5, 2017 If Transferable it retains C&R status after reactivation. There is an ATF statement somewhere on this. There is some value for transfers, not having to file a form to cross state lines, and I believe at least one state only permits ownership of C&R NFA Guns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wwiifirearms Posted December 5, 2017 Report Share Posted December 5, 2017 https://www.atf.gov/firearms/docs/atf-national-firearms-act-handbook-chapter-10/download Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Lone Ranger Posted December 6, 2017 Report Share Posted December 6, 2017 Curios status is determined by date of manufacture. If it applies, it applies and does not go away - just that when the subject firearm is a sample it becomes meaningless due to the restrictions on who can possess it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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