Petroleum 1 Posted October 7, 2017 Report Share Posted October 7, 2017 Hi guys...as I am out there looking online at the thompsons for sale I noticed a few maybe 1928's or M1 that have two different selector levers on the same gun. One is the blade type the other is the stake type you would see on the M1A1. Was the gun built that way?? or an armory rebuild, field repair?? does it make any difference in the value, operation, maybe one works better than the other?? thx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalbert Posted October 7, 2017 Report Share Posted October 7, 2017 Petroleum 1, No difference in function. It was probably switched out during service, but we'll never know for sure. Many collectors switch them out to either be the same style, or the style more appropriate for approximate date of manufacture. David Albertdalbert@sturmgewehr.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSMGguy Posted October 7, 2017 Report Share Posted October 7, 2017 Right. Generally speaking, you see the plain milled paddle type safety and pivot on original production late M1928A1 and M1 TSMGs. Collectors generally refer to the later M1A1 type as "pin" style. All are completely interchangeable, as David said. While I have not seen it authoritatively in print, it looks as though the paddle style controls were always replaced by pin type during depot rebuild of M1 TSMGs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paladin601 Posted October 7, 2017 Report Share Posted October 7, 2017 (edited) Just an more expedient manufacturing technique, the resulted in less cost and less time to make the part .3 types basic of pivot and safety, of course each manufacturer did go into more details on their own version.1. Paddles with knurling (Checkering), Colt and 1928 Savage and Auto Ordanance2. Paddles without Knurling ( Checkering)3. Pin style Edited October 7, 2017 by Paladin601 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petroleum 1 Posted October 7, 2017 Author Report Share Posted October 7, 2017 Here is an example of one I saw online for sale. http://www.gunbroker.com/item/705651987 Sent from my iPhone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalbert Posted October 7, 2017 Report Share Posted October 7, 2017 Petroleum 1, That's a West Hurley M1. Mine came with the pin type selectors, and every one I've seen also came with pins. That being said, I would not be surprised if this one came from AO WH with mismatched selectors, but it's probably more likely that the safety selector was changed out after purchase. This was not an arsenal refit, as West Hurleys are civilian Thompsons, with the M1 models being manufactured in 1985-86. David Albertdalbert@sturmgewehr.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paladin601 Posted October 8, 2017 Report Share Posted October 8, 2017 (edited) I have never seen Pop rivets used on the rear sight, is that common with West Hurleys? I would trust that to keep the sight on http://pics.gunbroker.com/GB/705651000/705651987/pix520263035.jpg Edited October 8, 2017 by Paladin601 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadycon Posted October 8, 2017 Report Share Posted October 8, 2017 One of Westie's trademarks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petroleum 1 Posted October 8, 2017 Author Report Share Posted October 8, 2017 How were the rear sights fastened on the other original thompsons? were they prone to rattle loose and this is a WH fix?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalbert Posted October 8, 2017 Report Share Posted October 8, 2017 All rear sight rivets can come loose. The WH rivets are more prone to do so. Mine came loose on my WH M1, and some here may remember me shooting without the rear sight during a TATA Show and Shoot. My rivets came loose inside the receiver, but stayed solidly attached to the sight itself. I ended up using a black RTV type cement to keep it in place, and that has worked for a couple of years now. (Hey, if it works, it works...) David Albertdalbert@sturmgewehr.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motorcar Posted October 8, 2017 Report Share Posted October 8, 2017 How were the rear sights fastened on the other original thompsons? Real rivets, not pop rivets. Mine have lasted 76 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
huggytree Posted October 8, 2017 Report Share Posted October 8, 2017 most if not all parts can be interchanged, finding a correct thompson is unlikely....you may need to buy some parts and make it correct....some here would argue what correct is? if an arsenal rebuild changed the selector does that make it wrong? maybe a field fix.....for me i would want to make the gun correct the way it left the factory....just look at the gun and see how much you'd need to spend to get to where you want to be with it and adjust your offer/bid accordingly.....finding a 100% correct gun doesnt happen often from what ive seen original finish,barrel and # matching are the main things...everything else can be changed back to correct Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadycon Posted October 9, 2017 Report Share Posted October 9, 2017 Just like Huggy said, many collectable items usually corrected back to factory specification. Cars are a good example, why not guns? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paladin601 Posted October 9, 2017 Report Share Posted October 9, 2017 (edited) One way is with Countersunk Screws and Loctitehttp://www.90thidpg.us/Equipment/Reviews/AOThompson/Images/PICT4887.JPG Edited October 9, 2017 by Paladin601 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paladin601 Posted October 9, 2017 Report Share Posted October 9, 2017 (edited) another and the way the manufacturer did is with flat head countersunk rivets. http://m9.i.pbase.com/g9/05/388005/2/151116229.HSfnykVv.jpg Edited October 9, 2017 by Paladin601 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paladin601 Posted October 9, 2017 Report Share Posted October 9, 2017 Here are Original rivetshttp://www.keystonearms.com/images/products/detail/0052TMP.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paladin601 Posted October 9, 2017 Report Share Posted October 9, 2017 The problem with the "pop rivets" is that they extend into the bolt chamber and they are hollow. a nail like mandle is forced up into the tube and may come loose from use. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petroleum 1 Posted October 9, 2017 Author Report Share Posted October 9, 2017 (edited) Great info guys...I like the counter sunk screw mounting idea. I assume the receiver is beefy enough to handle the thread tap. Edited October 9, 2017 by Petroleum 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paladin601 Posted October 9, 2017 Report Share Posted October 9, 2017 Great info guys...I like the counter sunk screw mounting idea. I assume the receiver is beefy enough to handle the thread tap.the thread are fine and don't have much to grab, so tighten carefully. Some red loctite will help. Then if you have to remove the screw, heat the screw with a soldering iron to break the Loctite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buzz Posted October 9, 2017 Report Share Posted October 9, 2017 Threading a pre-45 thompson receiver for screws would be a travesty. Huggy, What's correct? A lot of guys remove original parts from their guns and replace them because "the experts" tell them that the original parts are incorrect. Most of the time, it's pure guesswork. This problem has reached mental illness proportions among Garand collectors, it's hard to watch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petroleum 1 Posted October 9, 2017 Author Report Share Posted October 9, 2017 I dont own one yet but if it came from the armory like that or it was a field repair that would be fine with me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paladin601 Posted October 9, 2017 Report Share Posted October 9, 2017 (edited) Threading a pre-45 thompson receiver for screws would be a travesty. Huggy, What's correct? A lot of guys remove original parts from their guns and replace them because "the experts" tell them that the original parts are incorrect. Most of the time, it's pure guesswork. This problem has reached mental illness proportions among Garand collectors, it's hard to watch.Probably the holes on the WH have been drilled out larger for the pop rivets. Besides the holes can always be filled later As for the Garand the so called experts who sell the parts are the problem Edited October 9, 2017 by Paladin601 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
huggytree Posted October 9, 2017 Report Share Posted October 9, 2017 I dont own one yet but if it came from the armory like that or it was a field repair that would be fine with me.thing is you would never know....that was too long ago...it could have been messed with by multiple owners since..... if you go back to original 1942 you cant go wrong....but some will argue that out too.....when tossing parts on the gun on an assembly line whatever is in the box next to them is what goes on the gun...left over parts, old stock found somewhere.... my gun was easy...its a police gun....it should be as it was made in 1940.....and thats what i did...spent 1.5 years making it as correct as i can and spending $1,500 to do so....ive got a replacement barrel, so it will never be 100% correct...but at some point you have to call a project done.....a ww2 gun has lots of grey areas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
huggytree Posted October 9, 2017 Report Share Posted October 9, 2017 Threading a pre-45 thompson receiver for screws would be a travesty. Huggy, What's correct? A lot of guys remove original parts from their guns and replace them because "the experts" tell them that the original parts are incorrect. Most of the time, it's pure guesswork. This problem has reached mental illness proportions among Garand collectors, it's hard to watch.having bought a ''collector'' Garand and degreased/refinished the wood and shot the gun i know this to be true....advice there is like this forum x 10 or x100....everyone gives different advice to the point where its useless as you dont know who to trust....everyone has a better way to degrease or a better way to deal with the wood.....in the end i just did what i felt was best and it turned out beautiful.... as far as Thompsons go--you are correct...ask 10 experts what is correct and ill bet you get 10 different versions of correct........as an owner you need to decide where you want to go on your gun....make the M1 look like the pics from 1942 or leave it as is and consider it was mismatched from an arsenal redo myself...id make it correct to factory specs as im anal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buzz Posted October 9, 2017 Report Share Posted October 9, 2017 (edited) Huggy, I'm specifically referring to the hobby that garand guys have of making guns "correct". Almost all garands went through these giant army rebuild programs where they were broken down into piles of parts, the parts were gauged and the stocks were sanded and then they were all put back together. So now you have a couple of gurus deciding what's "correct" apparently by mind-melding with the guns like Mr Spock and a bunch of lemmings tearing their guns apart and making them 'correct." In the process, there are original parts being discarded. You have guys taking the original SA barrels off of an HRA and putting some skanky old HRA barrel on so that the gun will be "correct". Except that HRA ran short of barrels and the SA barrel on the gun is the actual original barrel. It's just a big free for all, there's no rhyme or reason to it. My M1A1 thompson is an RIA rebuild, it's like a brand new gun. Is it correct? yes, it's correct for an RIA rebuild. I'm not going to mess with it. As far as wood refinishing goes, gun guys go out of their way to torture guns. They use weird chemicals and dyes that aren't even for wood and they use varnishes and stains incorrectly, they come up with elaborate procedures to do simple tasks. No fine woodworker would dream of slathering a piece of furniture with the bizarre assortment of crap that gun owners put on gun wood. The irony is that most gun stocks are american black walnut and it is bone simple to refinish, you have to try to screw it up. I've seen garand stocks that were dyed a horrible coppery red color, bleached out to a greenish gray with harsh chemicals, it's a awful situation. I think there was some gunsmith back in like 1955 that wrote some article on the worst way to refinish wood on earth and the whole gun fraternity just ran with it. Like the way some gun shop bubba said that M16 bullets tumble in flight and it became a "thing". these guys don't even know how to remove the rear handguard on a garand. you pull forward and it pops off. they have these guys prying it off with screwdrivers, scratching up the barrel and when the retaining clip sticks to the wood, the wood bends and cracks then they go crazy trying to get their cylinder lock to clock around exactly to 6 o-clock, even though it unneeded and does nothing useful. They put a pipe wrench on the gun and over-tighten it. like i said, watching people torture collector guns is not for the weak of heart Edited October 9, 2017 by buzz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now