Jump to content


Photo

Bi Plane Winchester


  • Please log in to reply
18 replies to this topic

#1 jim c 351

jim c 351

    Long Time RKI Member

  • Board Benefactor
  • 2768 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Ohio

Posted 28 January 2018 - 10:45 AM

I guess this link should be posted on the Bi Plane forum, but since we don't have such a forum, I will post it here, like I always do. Jim C https://www.rockisla...winchester-1907


Edited by jim c 351, 28 January 2018 - 10:45 AM.

  • 0

#2 OCM

OCM

    Outlaw History Expert - Respected Member

  • Board Donor
  • 2352 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Rocky Mountains
  • Interests:Classic cars used by the 1930s outlaws,
    Collecting outlaw artifacts from the 30s, Brewing, BBQ ribs, old aircraft, massive tinkering, Etc....

Posted 28 January 2018 - 04:09 PM

Congratulations Jim, yet another addition to your growing collection. 


  • 0

#3 levallois

levallois

    RKI Member

  • Regular Group
  • 152 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Sonoran Desert
  • Interests:Triumph sports cars from the 50s and Datsun sports cars from the 60s. Also collecting vintage guns, toys, hats and scotch. Interested in the late 19th and early 20th century American West, 1930s motorized bandits, Mexican Punitive Expedition, Boer War, Spanish-American War, WWI and WWII.

Posted 28 January 2018 - 06:14 PM

Super rare item! I’ve been corresponding with Alan D. about these and we haven't seen more than 4 or 5 of them out there (including this one) over the last few years. Supposed to have been 120 sent over and modified prior to the regular use of the Lewis machine gun in British airplanes. Very cool !!
  • 0

#4 jim c 351

jim c 351

    Long Time RKI Member

  • Board Benefactor
  • 2768 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Ohio

Posted 28 January 2018 - 07:35 PM

Sandy,

Not mine. Just forwarding a link from your buddy John.

Jim C


  • 0

#5 OCM

OCM

    Outlaw History Expert - Respected Member

  • Board Donor
  • 2352 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Rocky Mountains
  • Interests:Classic cars used by the 1930s outlaws,
    Collecting outlaw artifacts from the 30s, Brewing, BBQ ribs, old aircraft, massive tinkering, Etc....

Posted 28 January 2018 - 08:47 PM

$9500 is out of my world on something like this-  thought  you might of still been flush after that Colt Commercial 19 you just got-

Work for food here..... 


  • 0

#6 HANS

HANS

    Regular Member

  • Regular Group
  • 143 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Germany
  • Interests:Firearms, gangsters

Posted 29 January 2018 - 04:01 AM

Note that they are claiming the magazine holds 15 rounds, when it is clearly the standard 10-rounder (as it is supposed to be for the British issue carbines). I expect better from a large auction house like that.

 

Cheers

 

HANS


  • 0

#7 levallois

levallois

    RKI Member

  • Regular Group
  • 152 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Sonoran Desert
  • Interests:Triumph sports cars from the 50s and Datsun sports cars from the 60s. Also collecting vintage guns, toys, hats and scotch. Interested in the late 19th and early 20th century American West, 1930s motorized bandits, Mexican Punitive Expedition, Boer War, Spanish-American War, WWI and WWII.

Posted 29 January 2018 - 10:09 AM

The 15-round and 20-round mags have been an urban myth for decades.  I've looked for them for the last 10 years and have never seen one for sale.  I suspect that people look at the 10 rounders and just guess they hold 15 or 20 rounds.  Of course, there is the photo of the "French" 1907 with two mags put together but it looks like a custom job.  Even the Lebman guns were recovered in Tucson with 10 rounders.  If I'm wrong, it won't be the first or last time, and I'd love to see one.  Unfortunately, I don't think I'm wrong.


  • 0

#8 OCM

OCM

    Outlaw History Expert - Respected Member

  • Board Donor
  • 2352 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Rocky Mountains
  • Interests:Classic cars used by the 1930s outlaws,
    Collecting outlaw artifacts from the 30s, Brewing, BBQ ribs, old aircraft, massive tinkering, Etc....

Posted 29 January 2018 - 12:16 PM

Typical auction house .


  • 0

#9 jl7422

jl7422

    Regular Member

  • Regular Group
  • 134 posts

Posted 29 January 2018 - 01:29 PM

Man, I'd love to add one of those aviation '07's to my collection.

 

Re: extended magazines: Like levallois I too have been searching for years for the mythical extended magazines. Have yet to see or handle one.  OCM and I have had several conversations about these (along with the origins of the Lebman Mini extended mags).  I did receive an odd 07 magazine with a police rifle that I believe to be an aftermarket from back in the day. It is not the current aftermarket. It might fit 12rnds, as it appears a bit longer than the factory, but not much.        


  • 1

#10 levallois

levallois

    RKI Member

  • Regular Group
  • 152 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Sonoran Desert
  • Interests:Triumph sports cars from the 50s and Datsun sports cars from the 60s. Also collecting vintage guns, toys, hats and scotch. Interested in the late 19th and early 20th century American West, 1930s motorized bandits, Mexican Punitive Expedition, Boer War, Spanish-American War, WWI and WWII.

Posted 29 January 2018 - 08:34 PM

Jl7422,

I would really love to see a photo or two that aftermarket magazine please. Are there any markings on it? Thanks!

John
  • 0

#11 jl7422

jl7422

    Regular Member

  • Regular Group
  • 134 posts

Posted 30 January 2018 - 12:00 AM

Hello John,

 

Let me dig the aftermarket mag out and I'll take some pics. and post them . . . or get OCM to help me post them.

 

Lots of snow here but I'll find it before the Spring thaw -- (a running gag with OCM)

 

John


  • 0

#12 HANS

HANS

    Regular Member

  • Regular Group
  • 143 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Germany
  • Interests:Firearms, gangsters

Posted 30 January 2018 - 04:02 AM

Man, I'd love to add one of those aviation '07's to my collection.

 

Re: extended magazines: Like levallois I too have been searching for years for the mythical extended magazines. Have yet to see or handle one.  OCM and I have had several conversations about these (along with the origins of the Lebman Mini extended mags).  I did receive an odd 07 magazine with a police rifle that I believe to be an aftermarket from back in the day. It is not the current aftermarket. It might fit 12rnds, as it appears a bit longer than the factory, but not much.        

 

 

I've searched high and low for these since they are mentioned several times in gangster files. I did find a photo of the Cake 15-rounder (it has five rather than four holes in the side and is visibly longer), but not the Cake 20-rounder (supposedly a curved mag). Then there is the weld-job (two 10-rounders) in the Winchester museum, obviously a one-off. Everything else is vapourware. I'm pretty certain that those 20-rounders in the FBI files and the ones supposedly available in WWI don't exist, just misidentifications.

 

Cheers

 

HANS


  • 0

#13 OCM

OCM

    Outlaw History Expert - Respected Member

  • Board Donor
  • 2352 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Rocky Mountains
  • Interests:Classic cars used by the 1930s outlaws,
    Collecting outlaw artifacts from the 30s, Brewing, BBQ ribs, old aircraft, massive tinkering, Etc....

Posted 30 January 2018 - 11:39 AM

Agree with HANS , just mis-identification. According to Henwood, factory just produced 5-10 rd magazines. Lebman certainly could of made one or two or ? 

If you're not familiar with the Winchester 1907, and it's 1933- 1934, one glance might say a 15 rounder sitting there. 

Ones in Tucson were 10 rounds, we've got photos of that and one still existing evidence file says 10 round magazines. 

I feel HANS, myself and CJL have geeked that 15-20 rd theory to death. 

anyway-

 

OCM 


  • 0

#14 levallois

levallois

    RKI Member

  • Regular Group
  • 152 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Sonoran Desert
  • Interests:Triumph sports cars from the 50s and Datsun sports cars from the 60s. Also collecting vintage guns, toys, hats and scotch. Interested in the late 19th and early 20th century American West, 1930s motorized bandits, Mexican Punitive Expedition, Boer War, Spanish-American War, WWI and WWII.

Posted 30 January 2018 - 08:41 PM

HANS - is the Cake mag marked in anyway or is it just the extra hole and length that is used to ID them? Is there any way that you could please post the photo of it here? Thanks!
  • 0

#15 jl7422

jl7422

    Regular Member

  • Regular Group
  • 134 posts

Posted 30 January 2018 - 11:13 PM

I found the aftermarket mag I was referencing in my post above (shown on the right). I checked and it easily fits 10 rnds, and if forced could make 11. No markings and no indicator holes. The spring is --maybe--half the strength of a factory 10 rnd. mag. I have no idea if it works--never had a reason to try it.

Attached Files


  • 1

#16 HANS

HANS

    Regular Member

  • Regular Group
  • 143 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Germany
  • Interests:Firearms, gangsters

Posted 31 January 2018 - 04:45 AM

HANS - is the Cake mag marked in anyway or is it just the extra hole and length that is used to ID them? Is there any way that you could please post the photo of it here? Thanks!

 

Frankly I can't prove it is a Cake magazine since I have only a sideview, although as far as I know Cake was the only one who made 15-rounders.

 

Cheers

 

HANS

Attached Files


Edited by HANS, 31 January 2018 - 04:46 AM.

  • 0

#17 OCM

OCM

    Outlaw History Expert - Respected Member

  • Board Donor
  • 2352 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Rocky Mountains
  • Interests:Classic cars used by the 1930s outlaws,
    Collecting outlaw artifacts from the 30s, Brewing, BBQ ribs, old aircraft, massive tinkering, Etc....

Posted 31 January 2018 - 11:35 AM

jl7422-

I had one like that , with no holes , with my 07 I had probably 20-25 years ago. I never thought to check capacity, hurt to much to load it that far anyway. 

Attached Files


  • 0

#18 full auto 45

full auto 45

    Respected Member

  • Board Benefactor
  • 4707 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Looking over your shoulder right now
  • Interests:Thompson's, Any Machinegun, Harley's and scuba diving. In that order.

Posted 15 February 2018 - 07:06 PM

Another one of my favorite guns. I had 12 at one time. That was well before the prices started going crazy. I kept one of the 2, I got from the WV PD when I got my M1 Thompson from them. My buddy has the other. Both had 5 round mags with them. I have picked up a couple of the 10 rounders over the years.There are a lot of the repop 10 rounders out there, but a real Winchester 10 round magazine is still pricey. I too have looked high and low for a 15 or the notorious 20 round magazine. Being a single stack mag with a what, 350 pound spring, is no fun to load, even a ten round mag. 

Now, to sell the 1910 and all the ammo and pickup another good 1907 or two. 


  • 0

#19 OCM

OCM

    Outlaw History Expert - Respected Member

  • Board Donor
  • 2352 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Rocky Mountains
  • Interests:Classic cars used by the 1930s outlaws,
    Collecting outlaw artifacts from the 30s, Brewing, BBQ ribs, old aircraft, massive tinkering, Etc....

Posted 15 February 2018 - 08:04 PM

Sell the 1910 to Colt Chopper, pocket change for him and Johnny Depp. Cheap shipping too. 

BTW, Lori, 1/2 the Leach book, lives up in Corunna, that's close to Hog's Liver Junction, south of Raccoon Tongue, crows fly to Auburn to you Indiana boys. 

Maybe , you can get an autographed book at the Spring Pea Shelling & Corn Likker Festival. 

I think I'd fly out to that one... 

 

OCM 


  • 0