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BSA TSMG Prototype .45 Cal


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PTRS-14.5,

A very rare Thompson indeed. You can see additional pictures and read the story of this Model of 1929 BSA serial No 2 Thompson in The Ultimate Thompson Book starting on page 177. Note the drum slots in the receiver. One picture I have not seen is a .45 caliber BSA Thompson with a drum. That would be a unique picture!

 

I have been interested in the knurling pattern on the cocking knob of the .45 caliber BSA actuator. The close-up picture is perfect for this observation. Do you have any pictures of the BSA actuator by itself?

 

Thank you for sharing. And saving this Thompson for future collections ;)

Edited by TD.
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TD and all,

 

Here are more images... The last owner never had this TSMG open and it was full of varnish and dried up crude...What a smuck.

 

I'm not too impressed with the Brits attempt here to build a TSMG knock off / improvement. The TSMG was clearly at the end of its developmental life!

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this was one of Michael Free's guns. the mag in the picture though is a 30 round military mag, while the gun when pictured in the Ultimate Thompson Book (page 182) included a 20 round magazine. When his guns were auctioned off, magazines and accessories were not included.

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I guess I better not fit std GI mags in TSMG's for images...

 

Thanks Dave! I'm sure happy you figured this all out for me/us !!!

 

God knows I could never afford 20 rd TSMG mags. Do you have any BSA or other British Mfg'd ones?

 

I guess I'll have save up for all the GOOD TSMG books too!

 

As for mags and accessories in the sale. You missed on this fact... It worked out far better than I planned for.

Edited by PTRS-14.5
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PTRS-14.5,

Thank you for the pictures of the internals. This view should be a first for most Thompson enthusiasts. I for one am very grateful.

 

While I cannot be certain based only on pictures, it appears like Birmingham Small Arms Ltd (B.S.A.) manufactured every internal part of this prototype .45 caliber Thompson. Given the very similar internal design to the Model of 1921/28 Thompson gun, I would have thought B.S.A. would have used an "off the shelf" complete Colt's bolt, Blish Lock, actuator and buffer pilot assembly since this was only a prototype gun. Of course, this begs the question - are the internal parts I referenced above interchangeable with a production Thompson gun?

 

Any and all additional information is appreciated. Thank you again for sharing!!! And please let us know if a production Thompson drum will actually fit this BSA prototype.

 

All GREAT stuff!!!

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Congratulations on your purchases at the Free auction. you acquired some very valuable guns and some guns of historical significance. this forum is an information resource for Thompson enthusiasts. when anyone posts here, they should expect comments and questions. a frequesnt question on any gun is what is its provenance and what accessories came with it. others with information on these points will regularly share what they know. my understanding from the Trustee was that the auction was for the guns only and did not include accessories or magazines. If my information was incorrect, I apologize. If you were able to later get the magazines and accessories asociated with this gun, that makes your purchase that much better. As TD said, thank you for sharing pictures of this historically significant firearm.

Edited by DLansky
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PTRS-14.5,

Thank you again. At first glance I thought I was looking at a M1 receiver with Blish slots! Not surprisingly in 1929, it appears the oiler has been retained. The slot on the bottom of the bolt appears to be wider than on a stock Colt's 21/28 bolt. I have attached a picture of a Colt's bolt for Board members easy reference. No doubt about the frame internals being different.

 

bottomofupperreceiverwinternals.jpg

 

I would guess B.S.A. used a copy of the original Oscar Payne drawings/blueprints as furnished to Colt's when manufacturing the receiver internals since this was a joint venture with Auto-Ordnance Corporation.

 

If not already a member, I hope you will consider joining The American Thompson Association (TATA) and the Thompson Collectors Association (TCA) and attending one or both annual shows and shoots in Ohio. You will find the Thompson community a great place to show-off your wonderful collection before people who truly appreciate General Thompson's dream.

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PTRS-14.5, thank you very much, the picture of the lower receiver is highly interesting. The internal mechanisms in the lower receiver were almost entirely re-designed apparently.

If you find some time, I'd be very curious how the right side of the gun looks like. On your photos, we see the selector etc. on the left side - I wonder if they were also attached with a pivot plate similar to the AO-Thompsons, or if the whole arrangement was entirely different. How do you separate upper and lower on this BSA prototype? Is there also a button somewhere similar to the US-Thompsons, or was an entirely different mechanism used?

Thanks a lot for taking the time to share information and photos about this interesting variation!

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Freddy,

 

Photo of the right side of # 2. The Safety & Selector Lever(s) both have threaded shafts and are threaded into the right side of the lower, removal of both is by by turning / unscrewing until free. The sear and trigger assemblies are retained by separate straight slot screws also threaded into the right side.

 

A complete lower dis-assembly and photo session will be preformed on a later date when the galaxies are in perfect sync, an adequate amount of Starbuck's has been consumed and "steady hands" prevail. Hope that helps!

 

Stay safe,

 

Frank

 

 

 

 

 

http://i59.tinypic.com/15zfwj4.jpg

Edited by inertord
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