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Shrike jam


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#1 brucea4

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Posted 15 April 2019 - 10:05 AM

Anyone experience a jam like pictured with the Ares Defense Shrike?

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#2 johnsonlmg41

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Posted 15 April 2019 - 08:55 PM

I have seen it, but not personally experienced it.   The round does not nosedive fast enough because the topcover may not be closed all the way, or the feed tray has issues?  I made a feed tray back when they were shipping them with alum trays since I assumed they would get torn up.   I made one old school from an FN stamped tray the way Ares did them back before they milled them.  Guys refer to that as peening near the entrance to the barrel if it hits often enough.   Some have a relief cut in that area to help ramp the feeding?   That's really the only part of the design he screwed up where the tray should be a little lower in the receiver, but then you have the bolt to contend with.  There's a guy that sells an O ring to put under the upper pawl to force the round down harder, but that's a stopgap measure when the real problem can be the feed tray if you've exhausted all the other issues? 

I learned a ton about the system by making and fitting the feed tray.....but that was back a few years ago about 50 gun repairs/rebuilds back.  HTH


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#3 brucea4

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Posted 16 April 2019 - 01:49 AM

Interesting and thank you....


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#4 brucea4

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Posted 17 April 2019 - 10:32 AM

I have seen it, but not personally experienced it.   The round does not nosedive fast enough because the topcover may not be closed all the way, or the feed tray has issues?  I made a feed tray back when they were shipping them with alum trays since I assumed they would get torn up.   I made one old school from an FN stamped tray the way Ares did them back before they milled them.  Guys refer to that as peening near the entrance to the barrel if it hits often enough.   Some have a relief cut in that area to help ramp the feeding?   That's really the only part of the design he screwed up where the tray should be a little lower in the receiver, but then you have the bolt to contend with.  There's a guy that sells an O ring to put under the upper pawl to force the round down harder, but that's a stopgap measure when the real problem can be the feed tray if you've exhausted all the other issues? 

I learned a ton about the system by making and fitting the feed tray.....but that was back a few years ago about 50 gun repairs/rebuilds back.  HTH

How would the Shrike operate to begin with if the top cover is not closed all the way?  I will get several rounds out until one of these jams occur....


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#5 brucea4

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Posted 18 April 2019 - 10:58 PM

I double checked the top cover.  It is either closed or open, no in between.  So I don't think that is my problem....


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#6 DINK

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Posted 19 April 2019 - 06:23 AM

The early versions of the Shrike would allow the point of the bullet to rise up while being fed into the chamber and strike the receiver just above the barrel.  The receiver being aluminum, it would develop a divot there and provide a nice spot to catch bullet noses and bring the gun to a screeching halt.  Mark Genovese of Maui Arms developed a neat little plastic guide that goes into the empty space in the front of the top cover which guides the nose of the bullet down and into the chamber like it should travel.  Unfortunately, he is no longer making them and someone else has said they were going to start, but I don't recall where I saw this.

 

ARES has dealt with the problem with a big ugly (in my opinion) block of steel in the front of the receiver.  It also works, but is (once again- my opinion) a clumsy solution to the problem.  I would inquire about the Maui Arms block or clones of it around sites like AR-15.com and see if one is available yet.  I have one in my Shrike and it solves the "high bullet" problem very nicely.

 

Edit- I just found the thread in the M-16 forum in the "Armory" section of AR-15.com and posted an inquiry about progress on the guy's plan to replicate Mark's guide block.  The thread is titled "Mark Genovese's Shrike/MCR bullet guide".  If he actually proceeds with this, it would be a cheap and easy way to correct a known flaw with the early Shrikes.

 

https://www.ar15.com...103675#i5103675


Edited by DINK, 19 April 2019 - 07:30 AM.

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#7 MGTedFL

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Posted 12 May 2019 - 09:41 PM

I used to see this regularly with my "B" and "A" model early Shrike uppers, when I first started shooting them. I shoot them off a M16 RR, as well as a RDIAS. While I agree with the issues of of the bullet tip catching the receiver front, especially the steel core XM855, the other issue is that the Shrike has barely enough energy to fully cycle and then strip the next round from the links. There is nowhere near the energy cycling the gun as in the M13-linked M60. Using a Terry Rood link stretcher helped solve the issue. I stretch the front loop just enough to let the round proceed without getting caught. IMO, that is what is happening in your pics.The rear of the shell case is not clearing past the front loop of the link.  Just like good quality, properly functioning mags are the key to subgun success, properly functioning links are the key to a beltfed. 

 

So now....here is my personal secret sauce to Shrike success. First, use the correct links, as there are at least two different variants of M27 links. See my link to Bill Guiette's page below. Ones with holes,(Type I) ones without holes (Type II) with a slightly different pitch (more space between the rounds). Just ask Bill..... I have his universal linkers with interchangeable plates (M1 for 30-06, M1919 IDF, M13 and M27). I use the solid, parked Type II links, once shot Mil-surp, from Sarge's Drop Zone @5K for $200.  They get cleaned, tumbled to smooth the rough edges and stretched with Terry's link stretcher. I only use new LC XM855 62gr, 5.56 ammo, with the Shrike set to the largest gas port, and a H3 buffer with the Shrike oversized recoil spring.  Somtimes I give the belts a light misting with Ace Hardware brand Silicone spray. It is a "dry" silicone, not the wet & foamy CRC Wallmart crap. At the end of the shoot, I use a large wand-type magnet and pick them up, and the process begins again, less the stretching.

 

Don't get me wrong, I love my Shrikes, but you really gotta tweek them to get them to run consistent. Honestly, they are now among my favorite guns to shoot. I have one set-up with Terry's M249 buttstock kit and other accessories. The A-model with the round hand guard went to Tom Cassidy, who modded the HG to fit an original Minimi grip. This combined with a Terry Rood Savitt stock on a AR carbine tube, with a 12" barrel looks like an early para M249. 

 

On the other hand, if I don't want to deal with this crap ..... I can load up any crap milsurp 7.62X51 I can find, into my old IDF links and soot the M1919A4 all day long with never a stoppage.  FWIW, Ted

 

https://www.weguiett.../tech-info.html


Edited by MGTedFL, 13 May 2019 - 11:24 AM.

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#8 Frank Iannamico

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Posted 15 May 2019 - 07:51 AM

What is the source for the link stretcher? 


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