20 replies to this topic

[LIONHART]

I've been informed that UPS will no longer accept Machine Guns for shipment. Is this fact, or rumor? Anybody know? Just heard this today.

[marks]

Several dealers over on subguns have posted it is indeed fact. UPS's rules have become so screwed up anymore they arn't worth the trouble anymore anyway. I use Fed Ex second day air now. The less time an expensive item is in a contract carriers possesion the better as far as I'm concerned. It's worth the extra $$. If they know it's a gun our local UPS outlet won't even ship title 1 unless it's FFL to FFL. Experienced that first hand. Screw UPS.

[leid]

I filed a grievance with UPS over a gun part shipment. They claimed that gun parts had to be shipped "Next Day Air" at a very high price. It turns out that is not their official policy, so I am demanding a refund for their discrimination.
Carey

[TommyFan]

I just had my SBR shipped via UPS 3 day without problems. Is it a possible local problem?

[philasteen]

I've seen the discussion on other boards but so far UPS has not changed their policy. Neither their tariff nor their excess-of-loss insurance documents mention anything about this. Unless it's in there, whatever someone claims to have been told by email through customer service is not binding. So feel free to ship your NFA with UPS to your hearts content.

[LIONHART]

From the UPS Site:

Shipping Firearms

Special Procedures for Shipping Firearms

Use These UPS Services for Your Firearm Shipment
Firearms will be transported only between licensed importers, licensed manufacturers, licensed dealers, and licensed collectors, as defined in the United States Gun Control Act of 1968.
You must ship your packages that contain handguns with UPS Next Day Air Early A.M.®, UPS Next Day Air®, or UPS Next Day Air Saver® services
In locations where a UPS Next Day Air service is not offered, you must ship your packages that contain handguns with the most premium domestic air service available
Your packages that contain firearms will not be accepted for shipment at UPS Letter Centers, with UPS SonicAir® service, UPS Authorized Shipping Outlets (ASOs), or with international services
Follow These Packing Requirements
Your packages that contain handguns must be separated from other packages being delivered to UPS
Ammunition cannot be included in your packages that contain firearms (including handguns)
About Documentation and Labeling
When you are shipping a package that contains a firearm through a UPS Customer Center, you must have a letter on record with UPS stating your status as an authorized firearm shipper
When you are shipping your package that contains a firearm with UPS, you must affix a UPS label requesting an adult signature upon delivery
Getting Your Firearm Shipment to UPS
You can only ship your package that contains a firearm from UPS daily pickup accounts and through UPS Customer Centers
When you are shipping a package that contains a handgun, you must verbally notify the UPS driver or UPS Customer Center clerk
You can use UPS daily pickup accounts to ship firearms, not including handguns, through UPS Internet Shipping, UPS On-Call PickupSM, and One-Time Pickup
Your packages that contain firearms will not be accepted for shipment at UPS Letter Centers, with UPS SonicAir® service, UPS Authorized Shipping Outlets (ASOs), or with international services


There is nothing presented that states UPS no longer allows Machine Guns..

[leid]

The UPS branches located in the Kinko's store in Houston, TX will not allow guns OR gun parts to be shipped at all. That is Kinko's policy, not UPS's.
I now use Fedex or USPS.
Carey

[21 smoker]

The last thompson I received from PK came from the little brown truck, and the next thompson I shipped to PK went via ups....nobody from ups ever asked what I was shipping ...just how much insurance I wanted to pay for...local pickup driver knew,cause I told him...that was in August...I do remember it`s easier to ship NFA than to ship title 1...

[Fencer]

I tried to ship a M1 Carbine and M1 Garand off via UPS to a repair location, and was told that I could not do so. Course the local
idiots wanted to know if I could remove the barrel so it would not be shootable. Alot of this comes from the idiots manning the local
shipping locations, their complete lack of understanding of weapons and some built in prejudice against gun owners they seem to have.

[Jay Thompson]

I am expecting delivery via UPS of an M1A1 to my dealer in McAllen, Texas, today. It was shipped UPS ground last Friday from Idaho.

[Lafayette Gregory]

All ups stores in the Killeen Texas refuse to accept firearms.....Franchise stores say they can make their own policies. I use USPS

[Zamm]

May I suggest FedEx....
In 20 years, I never had a problem with them for all sorts of shipping...
on the other hand, UPS has caused a great deal of destruction to items ( last one was a forklift tong driven completly
through a crate) and just try to collect the insurance...
Best, Zamm

[LIONHART]

FedEx? NO WAY! Just went through an ordeal with those folks...Never had a problem with UPS..Anyway, I'll post my troubles here. A few weeks back, probably two weeks ago, I participated in a group buy for new Bulgarian AK47 Waffle Magazines. You know, the tough as nails, black synthetic ones..Well, I ended up purchasing 40 of these babies through the group buy, but purchased many before the buy was announced by the vendor.. Anywho, the Company charged my Credit Card, and shipped those Magazines via FedEx..Guess what? While the delivery man was on his way here, to my residence, the box busted opened. He did not try to make a delivery. I called FedEx the day I was supposed to receive them, and the individual informed me, that my Box was sent back to the Shipping Center, as I was unavailable for delivery! Which wasn't true...I called again, and I talked with a lady who informed me that my box did in fact get returned to one of their Shipping Centers, but that it was heading to their Seattle location for inspection/investigation as the contents of the box were exposed, due to the damage. After about two days or so, I did receive my goods, in a new box provided by FedEx, everything undamaged, but now I'm sure, I have been added to some sort of Watch List, if I haven't been already. Bunch of Ass Holes..

[catnipman]

I have online shipping accounts for USPS, UPS, and Fedex, and all three web sites are pretty darn good for creating, printing and paying for shipping labels.

I've recently discovered that FedEx ground is substantially cheaper than UPS ground, though I haven't done any comparison checking on their faster services. Because FedEx ground is so much cheaper than UPS, I'm switching all of my larger package shipments to FedEx. USPS is still subtantially cheaper for 1-2 pounds shipped Priority Maill, which indeed results in fast delivery, very much quicker than UPS ground in most cases.

The thing that makes USPS non-competitive is their very high insurance costs for expensive items. I've always wondered if the USPS loss/damage experience is such that these much higher insurance costs are necessary for them!

I've never really had any problem with any of them, but do greatly prefer FedEx and UPS being able to track their packages online. USPS can't really track most of their packages, which in today's world is essentially not acceptable for most kinds of packages.

I agree that for shipments involving expensive items, the less time in the carrier's hands the better, though I ship ground for everything else since it is usually so much less expensive.

[Sig]

I do not know if this policy to not ship NFA at UPS is true or not. IF true I am concerned. It feels great that many are saying on other boards we are going or would like to hurt them by taking all shipping business elsewhere, well honestly I do not believe we could possibly hurt them, we are way too few for them to feel any pain.

Gun owners typically have not rallied around others minority gun owners issues. Thus a shotgun owner is very unlikey to help an NFA owner. This is how England and Australia slowly but surely squeezed all guns out of civilians hands, one small ban at a time a tale recently shared to the Thompson Collectors Association by a British Army officer. The owner of a gun that was not banned would not rally to the assistance of anyone who hand potentially banned weapons. The ones who already had their guns banned of course would not speak up for the other potential class of banned gun owners.

What concerns me most if another carrier say FedEx chose to do the same, not ship NFA items, well then where would we be? Not a pretty picture in my opinion. Let's say the other carries decide to do the same thing, well what are we going to do drive each NFA item from state to state and hand deliver them. I don't think so. No carriers = almost a ban.

I would rather see some discussion from the NRA to resolve the issue with UPS to change the policy, I think this would be much more productive use of my efforts on this matter and more likely to see real benefit if more than a few of us did the same. Reasonable business people usually can find a solution.

I will be sending a note to the NRA to look into the issue.

[TD.]

Michael,
I think that is an excellent idea. I suggest making the Thompson Collectors Association aware of this potential issue since the Association is now affiliated with the NRA. With the great exhibit now on display, it may have some clout. From a practical standpoint, any business now a day that pays their bills on time is not being ignored. If one shipper had the reputation of catering to the gun owners, I think it could nearly corner the gun-shipping marketplace overnight. If this shipper had the business it would probably use some of its advertising budget in the gun community. This is a win win situation for everyone. Of course, good service and fair prices would also be necessary. UPS, Fed-Ex and DHL are certainly some of the main carriers. However, I wonder if the US Postal Service would be approachable on this topic. Don’t be fooled into thinking the USPS does not need the business. And the USPS certified mail program is one of the cheapest and safest methods of shipping. Let us know if you get any feedback from the NRA.

[Grey Crow]

When I shipped my 27 to PK, UPS never questioned the content of the box. With aprox. $2,000 in insurance it went and returned without a hitch. The shipping was around $43.00 each way. I couldn't jump a plane or drive to CO for $86.00 round trip.

[Sig]

TD
Good idea to get TCA involved.
Sent a note to TCA and NRA-ILA action center.
But we ALL need to do this not just me.
michael

[Sig]

See portion near the bottom:
The shipping of automatic weapons is prohibited in the UPS system.

Definition

Automatic Weapon - An automatic weapon is any weapon which is
designed to shoot automatically more than one shot without manual
reloads by a single function of the trigger.


Dear :

Thank you for your inquiry. The following list explains who
can send and receive shipments of handguns or firearms through
UPS:
____________________________________________________________________________

Shipper
-Licensed Collectors

Consignee
-Licensed Collectors
-Licensed Gun dealer
-Gun Manufacturer (as a result of repair or adjustment only)
-Law Enforcement Agency (not a police officer at home)

Clarification: A police officer may be licensed to carry a handgun,
but is usually not a licensed dealer.
____________________________________________________________________________
___

Shipper
-Gun Manufacturer

Consignee
-Gun Manufacturer
-Licensed Gun Dealer
-Licensed Collector
-Individual (as a result of repair or adjustment only)
-Law Enforcement Agency (not a police officer at home)

Clarification: A police officer may be licensed to carry a handgun,
but is usually not a licensed dealer.
____________________________________________________________________________
___

Shipper
-Licensed Gun Dealer

Consignee
-Licensed Gun dealer
-Licensed Collector
-Gun Manufacturer (as a result of repair or adjustment only)
-Law Enforcement Agency (not a police officer at home)

Clarification: A police officer may be licensed to carry a handgun,
but is usually not a licensed dealer.
____________________________________________________________________________
___

Shipper
- Individual

Consignee
Gun Manufacturer (for repair or adjustment only) and from a person
not otherwise prohibited by Federal, State or local law to a
licensed importer, licensed manufacturer or licensed dealer for
the sole purpose of repair or customizing.
____________________________________________________________________________
___

Please note, the shipment of a firearm from an individual to
an individual is prohibited in the UPS system.

UPS will only accept handguns for shipment (from and to authorized
legal parties) via UPS Next Day Air services (Early A.M., Next
Day Air, or Next Day Air Saver).

Handguns cannot be shipped from the following:

One Time Pickup
On Call Pickup
Letter Centers (drop boxes)
The UPS Store
Internet Shipping
UPS Sonic Air
UPS Authorized Shipping Outlets (ASOs)

This UPS procedure change affects only handguns, not all firearms.
As a responsible corporate citizen, UPS wants to ensure that
handguns are transported as safely as possible by restricting
them to special handling methods within the UPS system. We intend
to continue serving our customers who lawfully ship handguns.

Other firearms, including shotguns, rifles, etc. can be shipped
by authorized legal parties via One Time Pickup service or through
a UPS Customer Center.

Firearms will not be accepted for shipment from any UPS Commercial
Counter and/or Authorized Shipping Outlet.

There cannot be anything written or printed on the package that
indicates the package contains a handgun or firearm. The shipper
cannot pack ammunition in the same shipping container as the
handgun. The shipper must segregate handgun shipments for the
driver. The shipper must apply the Adult Signature Required
label (21 years of age or older).

Antique Firearms

Antique firearms may be shipped via the UPS system, and are not
required to be shipped via UPS's Next Day Air service. An antique
firearm is a firearm that was manufactured in or before 1898
or any replica, muzzle-loading rifle, muzzle-loading shotgun,
and muzzle-loading pistol, which are designed to use black powder
or a black powder substitute. An antique firearm cannot use fixed
ammunition and is not considered a handgun for the purposes of
determining the method the antique firearm may be shipped.


Fireworks

All common fireworks or fireworks devices suitable for use by
the public and designed primarily to produce visible effects
by combustion, and/or small devices designed to produce audible
effects are prohibited in the UPS system.

Ammunition:

UPS accepts domestic ground and air shipments of ammunition that
have been classified by the shipper as "Cartridges, small arms",
or "ORM-D" (Other Regulated Material). The package must be properly
marked according to the requirements of Title 49 of the Code
of Federal Regulations (49 CFR). A Hazardous Materials Transportation
Contract may be required to ship such packages with UPS. Contact
the Hazardous Material Support Center at 1-800-554-9964 for details
on regulatory information.

BB Guns, Pellet Guns and Air Rifles are not considered firearms
and can be shipped with no additional restrictions. Please note,
UPS cannot ship a CO2 cartridge that may be part of an Air Rifle.

The shipping of automatic weapons is prohibited in the UPS system.

Definition

Automatic Weapon - An automatic weapon is any weapon which is
designed to shoot automatically more than one shot without manual
reloads by a single function of the trigger.

We hope this information is helpful. If we may assist you in
the future, please let us know.

Thank you for using UPS Internet Services.

Barbara
SATCSC

[philasteen]

QUOTE (Sig @ Oct 24 2004, 02:33 PM)

<snip>The shipping of automatic weapons is prohibited in the UPS system. Definition Automatic Weapon - An automatic weapon is any weapon which is designed to shoot automatically more than one shot without manual reloads by a single function of the trigger. <snip>

Is this in the tariff? Unless it is it's not official and we're still not bound by it.

And btw screw UPS, I use fedex ground for everything, it's a lot cheaper.