WTB / WTT - Grip Mount & Rivets

[Piep]

What is the purpose for the bend in the grip mount?

Does it need to push against the barrel to keep it from flexing?

[reconbob]

. The bend in the grip mount is so the front of it will press tightly

against the barrel providing a rigid mount for the forend. Without the

bend a grip mount can be loose and the forend will of course also

rattle. Many grip mounts are very tight when installed in the receiver

but many are loose and if they do not press against the barrel there is

no way to tighten them. Also with the gun carried by the sling on the

swivel attached to the forend this can repeatley pull on a grip mount

and it can become loose.

 

Bob

[Adg105200]

Who made rivited grip mounts?

I know Stevens and Savage made the M1A1 riveted type grip mounts. They are pretty hard to come by these days.

(Edit) both mine are Stevens.

 

 

Also, as to movement on the M1A1 type and the straight grip mount bars they also would stake them to help prevent movement in the receiver.

 

I have a broken M1A1 grip mount bar that has the end bent. I'm not sure if it was bent during removal, or to help with movement even though it was also staked.

 

 

 

 

Andrew

Edited January 12, 2018 by Adg105200

[Scrambles]

Unfortunately I do not see making grip mounts any time soon. It is a very difficult

part to make - a 3/4" square bar gets 75% machined away. If you want to talk about waste, look at the magazine catch. Doug shared the idea to form bars as a batch process in a row, the majority of the cuts could be done at once. Splitting them apart later. Engineering of manufacturing is Dougs forte. He is absolutely amazing at coming up with large industrial level plans for even the simplest things. Sometimes this is a hindrance, but often results in unmatched products.. The piece has to be stress

relieved before machining, and hardened and blued after machining. as does most any machined part.. why the drama?

Now here is the big problem - for 75 years (Mass Produced) Thompson parts have been sold at a

fraction of what it would cost to (privately produce small runs) make them today. The "going rate" for an original grip

mount I would say is $125, if you can find one. I can find them, who is dictating the prices? Overseas vendors? Thats what people expect ?? to pay and if

you try to sell a new manufacture one for $125 people will reject it and say "why should

I by a repro for $125 when I can get an original for $125?" Because it can be better, more easily available, and backed by person. Some might not care about the history of the new post sample they are building.

Try to make it truly worth while

and profitable and sell it for more and you are now ripping people off. Wow, that went a bit crazy.. ripping people off? If they pay it, how is that ripping anyone off.

This dilemma will stay in place until the price of Thompson parts becomes so high

that it will become truly profitable to make them. But who is really going to do this? Me. the half dozen or so other active Thompson enthusiasts, anyone willing to try.

Making gun parts is an art. I just had some bolts made for the blank gun and they measure

OK and work OK but they look like hell because they were made on modern 4 and 5 axis

machines where surfaces are made by many small passes of a tool so you can use the

same tool for many operations. Then quit cheaping out, do that operation on a lathe buy more cutters, raise the price, increase quality of the product. Do you think Doug has a problem with the quality of his products, or a lack of customers? no. People Will pay almost anything to get exactly what they want. . The bolt head and web where the head joins the body

is not turned on a lathe and there are many lines or striations causing a rippled finish (reminds me of the finish of the most of your work, quite messy)

which looks nothing at all like a Thompson bolt. But this is the new normal. To you? because of you!?

The grip mounts sold on GB and by Omega are OK but they are not bent before

hardening (Because the original prints were not available or known by them) and so will not flex tightly against the barrel. Just the type of important detail

that gets overlooked when the person making the part is not intimately familiar with the

part. Any parts for any piece of equipment is subject to this kind of oversight. It is common in automotive aftermarkets as well. Luckily, I do know many of these important details. Every detail matters.

I don't think the Thompson hobby and collecting will ever go away. It is an American

icon like Mickey Mouse, The New York Yankees, Harley Davidson, etc. It is the most iconic, and prevalent SMG in the USA, both bubba-built, and a common class 3 item. And ignoring these bubba built guns is idiotic and must be understood to run a Thompson business. I know we dont want to hear the truth, but other have said similar things, the majority are unregistered and in good responsible hands of those that are interested! Support them! Don't push them away. Don't think those Display guns were intended to remain Displays forever. The Idea of a display is perfect though, because it emphasizes the importance of these details in a "Non-gun" model and availability to everyone. But I don't think

you can make a living being a Thompson "guy". A profitable hobby - yes, but a good solid

living - no. It sounds like you are basing an absolute opinion off your limited personal experiences. I can clearly see where both you and doug have failed in making this a commercial sucess. I can also see how Kahr did exactly what you said isn't possible. I don't know that any young guys are getting in to it and the old established

guys are moving farther down the trail. Look at those old chubby bones shooting the 3 thompsons in slow motion. Wheres the young men of able age, who these guns were originally made for? No where to be found, and the few that do enter, are quickly showed out the door. Do you think anyone can afford more than a post sample? or is able to comply with the FFL/SOT requirements/ITAR just to get a fake post sample?

 

Bob

 

I could go on for hours and hours, but I did my best to stay relevant on this derailed thread.

Edited January 13, 2018 by Scrambles

[av8tr]

Well, it seems someone's panties are in a twist.

[mnshooter]

Well, it seems someone's panties are in a twist.

 

 

I must admit to being envious of anyone with such a complete knowledge of manufacturing and marketing.

Can't understand why he hasn't taken over the Thompson parts manufacturing business.

Edited March 20, 2020 by mnshooter

[ron_brock]

 

Interesting that a few threads ago you were complimenting Bobs work on grip hangers. Sounds that you have a good business plan. You should consider buying out Doug and setting up shop. As far as I know its all still for sale.

 

Ron

Edited January 13, 2018 by ron_brock

[ppgcowboy]

 

 

Who made rivited grip mounts?

I know Stevens and Savage made the M1A1 riveted type grip mounts. They are pretty hard to come by these days.

(Edit) both mine are Stevens.

Also, as to movement on the M1A1 type and the straight grip mount bars they also would stake them to help prevent movement in the receiver.

I have a broken M1A1 grip mount bar that has the end bent. I'm not sure if it was bent during removal, or to help with movement even though it was also staked.

IMG_20180112_183854.jpg

IMG_20180112_183909.jpg

Andrew

 

Thanks for answering that. I was going through my stuff and found two.

Edited January 13, 2018 by ppgcowboy

[reconbob]

. If you are going to make Thompson parts, then you have to make Thompson parts.

Sounds like you are a disciple of Doug in that for years Doug has been changing the design

of parts to make them -in his opionion - "better".

People don't want better parts, they want original or exact duplicate of original parts.

If a mag catch is made by making an extrusion die, and extruding the shape, and them

machining but with shortcuts to make it easier to make - guess what? It doesn't look like

an original, does not have the same quality, fit, as an original and nobody will buy them.

Dougs receivers have all been resigned to be. better or "the way he would have done it"

and most of the M2, 2M2, etc which have been described here are "wonky" receivers for

project guns, not receivers for Thompson submachine guns. You

probably don't remember Dougs Picatinny rail sight mount for the rear of a Thompson

receiver. Seriously, who would buy one? And Doug is still psyched about making a

universal trigger frame that can be used with attachments as a M1928A1, an M1, OR

accept a FOLDING UZI STOCK!

As I said to you before, if you want to do all of this just DO IT! Nothing is patented

and you can make anything you want, however you want, and sell for as much as you

want.

If, on the other hand your business plan is for Doug to give you his business because

you will work for him for free then 1) it won't happen, and 2) you are not willing to put YOUR

money on the line and I have no sympathy for you. Don't have money? Then start small and

slow like so many of us did and WORK your way up.

 

Bob

Edited January 13, 2018 by reconbob

[Piep]

Recon

Thank you for the info pertaining to the bend in the grip mount.

I suspected that might be it but wasn't sure.

 

Bob

[RP1379]

 

 

 

 

Who made rivited grip mounts?

I know Stevens and Savage made the M1A1 riveted type grip mounts. They are pretty hard to come by these days.

(Edit) both mine are Stevens.

Also, as to movement on the M1A1 type and the straight grip mount bars they also would stake them to help prevent movement in the receiver.

I have a broken M1A1 grip mount bar that has the end bent. I'm not sure if it was bent during removal, or to help with movement even though it was also staked.

IMG_20180112_183854.jpg

IMG_20180112_183909.jpg

Andrew

Thanks for answering that. I was going through my stuff and found two.

[RP1379]

Hi,

I'm new to the forum. Very interesting topic. I am in desperate need of an original Savage or Steven marked M1A1 riveted grip bar. Are you interested in selling one of those two you found? If this reply is out of line or not the correct place to ask, I apologize.

[bob241]

RP1379, this grip mount is forsale on GB,

 

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/741797006

[ppgcowboy]

That is exactly what I have. Note they are no marked.

[RP1379]

Thanks bob21. I had been watching that M1A1 grip mount on GB. I was holding out for a Savage marked one.

I keep looking.

Thanks

[buzz]

If you have an M1 or M1A1, I recommend that you put a foregrip band on.

 

Once that band is on and tightened properly, the foregrip becomes extremely rigid. I doubt you could break the grip mount when the band is in place. Unless you pried at it with a screwdriver.

 

Did they use them on 1928A1s also? If so, I would put one on a 28A1 as well.

 

BIG improvement.

[Adg105200]

Thanks bob21. I had been watching that M1A1 grip mount on GB. I was holding out for a Savage marked one.

I keep looking.

Thanks

It seems that Savage marked M1A1 and 1928 grip mount bars are a bit hard to find. You will see mostly Stevens and AOC marked.

 

I see the grip mount bar on GB sold.

 

Andrew

[RP1379]

Would a STEVENS marked riveted fore grip mount be correct for a SAVAGE M1A1? Or were they primarily used on AOC production?

Warmest regards

[1952HRA]

Stevens made most of the internals/small parts for savage, so yes it would be correct on a Savage, if I remember correctly Stevens was technically part of savage

[Adg105200]

Would a STEVENS marked riveted fore grip mount be correct for a SAVAGE M1A1? Or were they primarily used on AOC production?

Warmest regards

I know Savage and Stevens along with other parts contractors filled in for AOC early on during 1928 production, so I wouldn't be too surprised to see Savage or Stevens parts on at least earlier AOC M1s. Usually you won't find AOC parts on a Savage though unless it has been serviced/repaired at some point.

 

But as already mentioned above, Stevens and Savage parts are both correct in a Savage.

 

If you don't already have it, I recommend getting Frank Iannamico's book: American Thunder III.

 

Andrew

[RP1379]

I'll order it today. I tried to buy book 1 a while back, but finaly gave up when I couldn't find it. Hopefully I'll have better luck with book 2.

Thanks again

[jim c 351]

Savage bought Stevens around 1920. Apparently different stamps were used for quality control purposes, to identify which factory made them.

So if a collector thinks one or the other is more correct on their gun, knock yourself out.

Jim C

[ppgcowboy]

Does anyone know who made riveted grip mounts that were not marked?

[Bridgeport28A1]

Some are stamped very light. I have a square "S" Stevens is that is very hard to see. It is on the left side just below the front (muzzle end) stud.

[benedw60]

If you had a rivited grip mount what would it be worth?