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1928 Buffer & Pilot


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#1 Tiz

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Posted 11 July 2019 - 08:33 AM

What type of buffer and buffer pilot is this and is it safe to use in my 1928? I just haven't seen one like it before.

Thanks

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#2 giantpanda4

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Posted 11 July 2019 - 09:19 AM

Something similar to that showed up in a box of parts that also contained a Gunmachines speedbolt and shaved Blish lock. It may be from Gunmachines. 

I am curious to know if anyone else has seen one of these too?


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#3 TD.

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Posted 11 July 2019 - 09:22 AM

Tiz,

This is a first for me. I believe it is from your 1928 West Hurley? If so, I would really inspect the rear of the receiver for potential cracks and damage. There is probably nothing to worry about but a careful inspection is definitely in order.

 

This assembly needs to be replaced with a GI buffer pilot. I recommend a polyurethane disc from Diamond K. As shown in my current book on page 157, PK makes two types of discs. I recommend purchasing both (under $20) and deciding which one your WH likes best. My WH likes both of them! 

 

I will have a number of GI buffer pilots for sale at the upcoming All Thompson Show & Shoot and later Thompson Collectors Show & Shoot, including some of the early buffer pilots with the axis holes or centers.

 

I just noted Mike's reference above to a possible GunMachine's part. Excellent thought! But do not use it!  


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#4 Tiz

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Posted 11 July 2019 - 09:30 AM

Tiz,

This is a first for me. I believe it is from your 1928 West Hurley? If so, I would really inspect the rear of the receiver for potential cracks and damage. There is probably nothing to worry about but a careful inspection is definitely in order.

 

This assembly needs to be replaced with a GI buffer pilot. I recommend a polyurethane disc from Diamond K. As shown in my current book on page 157, PK makes two types of discs. I recommend purchasing both (under $20) and deciding which one your WH likes best. My WH likes both of them! 

 

I will have a number of GI buffer pilots for sale at the upcoming All Thompson Show & Shoot and later Thompson Collectors Show & Shoot, including some of the early buffer pilots with the axis holes or centers.

 

I just noted Mike's reference above to a possible GunMachine's part. Excellent thought! But do not use it!  

Thanks.

It is from my recently acquired WH. I have 2 GI, Savage marked, buffer pilots with fiber disks in my parts box should I replace this unusual pilot and buffer with one of those, in your opinion? The buffer pictured appears to be of a rubber or polymer compound, strange, at least to me. Hoping for more input from other members. Does PK have a website where I can order his poly discs?

PS: I never heard of GunMachine's who are they?


Edited by Tiz, 11 July 2019 - 09:33 AM.

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#5 TD.

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Posted 11 July 2019 - 09:50 AM

Tiz,

See FAQ, above: 

 

Is there a reputable, competent, Thompson gunsmith I can send my semi or full auto Tommy to for work, modifications, or tweaking? 

Diamond K/Paul Krogh p-k@[NO SPAM]q.com **Remove NO SPAM 1390 East 7th Street Delta, CO 81416 970-874-5750 ---------------------- Paul (the boards 'PK') performs quality repairs and modifications on all Thompson full automatic and semi automatic guns. Specialties include, but are not limited to, West Hurley tweaking, semi automatic modifications, short barrel replacements, sight and compensator pinning, polishing, reblueing, L drum work, and general gunsmithing chores. Paul also offers specialty modifications including enhanced '28 pilots, '21/ '28 hybrid pilots, modified '28 to '21 actuators, '28 Polyurethane buffers, and '21 style ejector conversions. 

 

Definitely install one of the GI Savage (S) marked buffer pilots. Do not use the assembly you posted a picture of above (but it will make a great display piece and conversation starter :) No website for PK. I suggest sending him an e-mail requesting current price information on his discs and where to send your money. Yes, business done the old fashion way!
 


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#6 cbmott

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Posted 11 July 2019 - 03:29 PM

I just bought a couple dics and this was the shipping and price info he sent me...

$7.5o ea., postpaid

Cash, check or money order to:

Diamond K
1390 E. 7th St.
Delta, Co 81416
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#7 Tiz

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Posted 11 July 2019 - 04:04 PM

I just bought a couple dics and this was the shipping and price info he sent me...

$7.5o ea., postpaid

Cash, check or money order to:

Diamond K
1390 E. 7th St.
Delta, Co 81416

 

Thank you.

Do you have any thoughts on the ID of the buffer pilot and buffer I posted pictures of?


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#8 Tiz

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Posted 12 July 2019 - 01:35 PM

I have recently been informed that the pictures of the buffer and buffer pilot I posted when starting this thread were a Dough Richardson creation. Any thoughts on it's serviceability? 


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#9 Tiz

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Posted 12 July 2019 - 01:36 PM

Tiz,

See FAQ, above: 

 

Is there a reputable, competent, Thompson gunsmith I can send my semi or full auto Tommy to for work, modifications, or tweaking? 

Diamond K/Paul Krogh p-k@[NO SPAM]q.com **Remove NO SPAM 1390 East 7th Street Delta, CO 81416 970-874-5750 ---------------------- Paul (the boards 'PK') performs quality repairs and modifications on all Thompson full automatic and semi automatic guns. Specialties include, but are not limited to, West Hurley tweaking, semi automatic modifications, short barrel replacements, sight and compensator pinning, polishing, reblueing, L drum work, and general gunsmithing chores. Paul also offers specialty modifications including enhanced '28 pilots, '21/ '28 hybrid pilots, modified '28 to '21 actuators, '28 Polyurethane buffers, and '21 style ejector conversions. 

 

Definitely install one of the GI Savage (S) marked buffer pilots. Do not use the assembly you posted a picture of above (but it will make a great display piece and conversation starter :) No website for PK. I suggest sending him an e-mail requesting current price information on his discs and where to send your money. Yes, business done the old fashion way!
 

I have recently been informed that the pictures of the buffer and buffer pilot I posted when starting this thread were a Dough Richardson creation. Any thoughts on it's serviceability? 


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#10 mnshooter

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Posted 12 July 2019 - 10:25 PM

These are the Richardson designs, as listed in his catalog for a long time.

He also made a version for the 21, with an appropriately larger diameter pilot for the 21 spring.

The 21 version of the buffer looks like the 28 version shown, but without the recess for the pilot.

The raised portion of the rear of the buffers is so they will fit around the oiler.

He told me that his designs are the only ones that eliminate all rearward metal to metal contact.

To the OP's question: They are both extremely serviceable; and the only system I will use when shooting a Colt.

The 28 version you show has nothing in common with the West Hurley junk parts so thoroughly documented by TD.

Is it any better than the rubber donut?  Don't know, but the idea is sound. Use your choice when shooting your Colt.

 

I will bring examples of both DR buffers, plus the DR 21 style pilot, for display at TATA.

Sadly, like DR's unique Thompson tools, none are in production any more.


Edited by mnshooter, 12 July 2019 - 10:37 PM.

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#11 67ray

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Posted 13 July 2019 - 09:01 AM

While the receiver crack at the rear from an old/cracked buffer is widely held legend, has anyone actually seen such a crack?  Looks plausible, but is it like worrying about something that will never happen?

Although $7.50 part is probably not even worth thinking about . . .


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#12 Tiz

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Posted 13 July 2019 - 03:22 PM

These are the Richardson designs, as listed in his catalog for a long time.

He also made a version for the 21, with an appropriately larger diameter pilot for the 21 spring.

The 21 version of the buffer looks like the 28 version shown, but without the recess for the pilot.

The raised portion of the rear of the buffers is so they will fit around the oiler.

He told me that his designs are the only ones that eliminate all rearward metal to metal contact.

To the OP's question: They are both extremely serviceable; and the only system I will use when shooting a Colt.

The 28 version you show has nothing in common with the West Hurley junk parts so thoroughly documented by TD.

Is it any better than the rubber donut?  Don't know, but the idea is sound. Use your choice when shooting your Colt.

 

I will bring examples of both DR buffers, plus the DR 21 style pilot, for display at TATA.

Sadly, like DR's unique Thompson tools, none are in production any more.

All the internals on my WH, as well as the barrel, have been replaced with GI parts from the "Super Select Parts" set from IMA. The only part I did not recognize was the buffer pilot and buffer. In your opinion it is OK to use it, correct?


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#13 mnshooter

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Posted 13 July 2019 - 06:59 PM

These are the Richardson designs, as listed in his catalog for a long time.

He also made a version for the 21, with an appropriately larger diameter pilot for the 21 spring.

The 21 version of the buffer looks like the 28 version shown, but without the recess for the pilot.

The raised portion of the rear of the buffers is so they will fit around the oiler.

He told me that his designs are the only ones that eliminate all rearward metal to metal contact.

To the OP's question: They are both extremely serviceable; and the only system I will use when shooting a Colt.

The 28 version you show has nothing in common with the West Hurley junk parts so thoroughly documented by TD.

Is it any better than the rubber donut?  Don't know, but the idea is sound. Use your choice when shooting your Colt.

 

I will bring examples of both DR buffers, plus the DR 21 style pilot, for display at TATA.

Sadly, like DR's unique Thompson tools, none are in production any more.

All the internals on my WH, as well as the barrel, have been replaced with GI parts from the "Super Select Parts" set from IMA. The only part I did not recognize was the buffer pilot and buffer. In your opinion it is OK to use it, correct?

A little confusing: Are you saying this DR bufffer and pilot were the ones that came with your IMA SSP set?

That would be severely unusual.  IMA should have sent you a correct GI pilot with your kit.  If not, call them. 

But, to your asking for my opinion on these parts -yes.  I use this design, as well as the other modern buffers. 

I absolutely don't use the original hard red "not-a-buffer's" -21, 28, or M1.

I believe the DR designs are superior to anything else out there, and wouldn't hesitate to use (the parts in your photos) in one of my 28's.  

But, also realize that if you ever do manage to wear out the buffer (doubtful), there are no replacements, unless you make your own.

 

However, instead of asking me, you have a far better place to go with your questions. 

Doug Richardson is still around, and last I heard, will answer phone calls when he is in the US.

He invented it.  Why not ask him?  All my conversations with him have been very cordial, and he loves talking Thompsons.


Edited by mnshooter, 13 July 2019 - 07:04 PM.

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#14 Tiz

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Posted 13 July 2019 - 10:31 PM

 

These are the Richardson designs, as listed in his catalog for a long time.

He also made a version for the 21, with an appropriately larger diameter pilot for the 21 spring.

The 21 version of the buffer looks like the 28 version shown, but without the recess for the pilot.

The raised portion of the rear of the buffers is so they will fit around the oiler.

He told me that his designs are the only ones that eliminate all rearward metal to metal contact.

To the OP's question: They are both extremely serviceable; and the only system I will use when shooting a Colt.

The 28 version you show has nothing in common with the West Hurley junk parts so thoroughly documented by TD.

Is it any better than the rubber donut?  Don't know, but the idea is sound. Use your choice when shooting your Colt.

 

I will bring examples of both DR buffers, plus the DR 21 style pilot, for display at TATA.

Sadly, like DR's unique Thompson tools, none are in production any more.

All the internals on my WH, as well as the barrel, have been replaced with GI parts from the "Super Select Parts" set from IMA. The only part I did not recognize was the buffer pilot and buffer. In your opinion it is OK to use it, correct?

A little confusing: Are you saying this DR bufffer and pilot were the ones that came with your IMA SSP set?

That would be severely unusual.  IMA should have sent you a correct GI pilot with your kit.  If not, call them. 

But, to your asking for my opinion on these parts -yes.  I use this design, as well as the other modern buffers. 

I absolutely don't use the original hard red "not-a-buffer's" -21, 28, or M1.

I believe the DR designs are superior to anything else out there, and wouldn't hesitate to use (the parts in your photos) in one of my 28's.  

But, also realize that if you ever do manage to wear out the buffer (doubtful), there are no replacements, unless you make your own.

 

However, instead of asking me, you have a far better place to go with your questions. 

Doug Richardson is still around, and last I heard, will answer phone calls when he is in the US.

He invented it.  Why not ask him?  All my conversations with him have been very cordial, and he loves talking Thompsons.

Thanks. I will try and contact Mr. Richardson. The previous owner of my WH installed the Richardson Pilot and buffer. When I acquired the gun it had the DR pilot and buffer in it. I had never before seen this type of buffer and buffer pilot before so I posted a picture get some input.


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