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Is the era of recreational shooing over?


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Is the era of recreational shooting over? Will we ever be able to go to the range with a machine gun and just do a mag dump again? Even those of us who have stocked up on ammunition and or reloading supplies move closer to being out of ammo with each shot we take. Powder and primers have soared in price even if you can find them. The price on surplus or commercial ammunition has in many instances quadrupled in price. I was offered 4 times what I paid for a can of 192 rounds of AP M2 Ball ammo recently and turned down the offer. I posted a while back about a guy who did a minor mechanical job for me and asked if he could be paid with 100 rounds of 5.56MM in lieu of cash ... I paid him in ammo, and by current prices I paid him twice what he had quoted me to do the job for cash. Lesson learned. In January, I paid $720.00 for 200 rounds of 50-70 Government ... $3.60 per round. Thank goodness I use it in a single shot and can reload the cartridges ... Until I run out of powder and primers that is.

I spoke to a man who works in the ammunition industry for Federal, and he indicated that this demand for ammo will take years to go back to normal ... If they are allowed to stay in business. Just how many retailers of ammo will be able to ride out this period of "out of stock, no backorder"? My son attended an auction recently and said that rounds of ammo were being auctioned off by the single round ... Scary.
The bottom line is, I rarely shoot anymore and I will not sell any ammunition, even if I don't currently have use for it. I have a lot of 7.62×25 Tokarev that I used in a PPS43 that I sold and I will even keep that ammo even though I have no weapon chambered for that round.
As all things are connected, what will this do to the machine gun market?
Very unstable times.
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Very unstable times.....

 

Yes they are. Even though we've had price rises in ammo in the past and they came back to within fairly normal ranges, this time may be different. With the government spending 2 Trillion dollars more than they have every year and giving away free money to everyone, 27 Trillion in the red now, not only will uncertainty in the 2nd amendment keep prices high but inflation must eventfully rear it's ugly head as well, prices may stay well above previous normals from here on out.

 

And yes the current ammo prices have restricted my shooting my full-auto guns. I did two C-drums dumps awhile back and it ain't cheap to burn 200 rds in less than a half minute anymore even if I have some cases of ammo in reserve. I see nothing good on the horizon regarding guns and ammunition, we are headed down a rocky road.

Edited by Mike Hammer
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Like I've always said, one of the hardest things to predict is what will happen in the future, so I won't even try.

What's happening now has happened every time a GD democrat has taken over the White House.

For me it started with L.B. Johnson , then Carter, then Clinton, then Obama and now Biden. All of them were anti gun.

This time is a little harsher because we went from the most pro gun president to the most anti gun president overnight.

To make matters worse, Biden told us ahead of time he wanted to destroy us and still won. Now democrats will no longer fear voting gun owners.

Hopefully , most of us have enough ammo to at least last 2 years a better yet 4. By then maybe we can get better representatives.

If you have friends who didn't stockpile ammo, I suggest you read the story of the three little pigs to them.

In the mean time, hang in there and don't drink the kool aid.

Jim C

Edited by jim c 351
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No shortage here, but I don't have time to shoot much so several lifetimes of ammo. Then I have bullets power and primers if I get desperate. I don't have many dies, but if there's no components for sale I'd bet in the future I can get 50bmg dies for $10 a set? I've put ammo up for sale with no takers and few guns lately and disproved some of the mythical prices on supposedly realized on gunbroker as schill bidding.

 

The future is in Kamala, pay no attention to the guy from the nursing home, he has no input on the matter at all. Jim C, you say every time a democrat wins the white house.....many of us and frankly many of them are not convinced they won it, so they may have to tread lighter than normal? With a 5 seat house majority it only takes 3 pedophiles to get caught, overdose, or your chinese spy girlfriend offs you, and the seats could flip? Or maybe 3 of them piss off the clintons and have random horrible accidents (those two things have nothing in common like trading cattle futures and being friends with Tyson foods legal counsel)? Call me an optimist! LOL

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I have a good friend with whom I've gone shooting several times a year. He declined going recently because he doesn't want to expend the ammo. I know he has a considerable stock. I guess he's taking it with him when he departs this vale of tears.

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I'm very sure things will get much worse before they get better . I kind of learned from the last shortage and stocked up after the prices and supplies returned to normal . My only screw up was buying a 5.56 belt fed . I started stocking up on .30 cent ammo about the time it reached .60 cents with one case limits per shipment . Stopped at 80 cents . Last 3 weeks I put up my SP primers and powders I had no need for up for sale in the local Super Shopper at $350 / 1,000 and $100 / pound or trade . Didn't sell a thing but traded all for CCI 41 primers and CFE223 powder . I then sold off the last of my 30-06 ammo and used that money to finish out being able to reload 12,000 rounds of 62 grain 5.56 at 57 cents per round , 2,000 at a pass . Lot of work to do this , but .57 is a bargain now compared to a 1.00 - 1.20 now and the ???? in three years .

Chris

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Certainly going to impact what we do. In many ways. Gas is already going up, and that will raise the prices on everything. Food at the grocery store etc is already going up. I think we'll be backing off a lot of the things we used to do. After Sandy hook it took years to see a 22 round, except for the guys who bought it all up and sold it on gunbroker. There certainly isn't (anymore) free chicken now. If you come over to shoot, better bring your own ammo. Stevie doesn't let anyone shoot his ammo anymore.

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I certainly hope the era of "recreational shooting" is not over. I'm just beginning (relatively speaking). And I also have hope that my niece/nephew will join me in that effort. Yes, it's hard to justify using ammo right now, but I have to do my best to use it as sparingly as possible. That, and look for bargains in getting new supplies. It's a lot of work, but well worth it.

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I ran a few belts out of my HK23EK to make sure it was functional after working on it. Other than that I dont plan to be hammering much full auto rifle caliber as ammo is just stupid. I have a decent supply of SubGun ammo and reloading supplies as well. Just wish Id bought more
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Just went to the range 2 days ago and blasted 8 mags on my Ingram m6. 2 of those were msg dumps. While I was there a guy showed up with his Thompson and did 2 drum mag dumps before I left. Ive got enough .45 to keep shooting a case or 2 a month for 2 years. Only enough 9mm to last a year(Ive started reducing my 9mm shooting a bit). Im on multiple pre order lists for .45 and 9mm. Some of which has come through, so I expect within a year the rest will come through also. All at 2019 prices. So Im hoping to be set through 2024. Next time ammo drops to pre 2019 levels I plan on insulating my house with cases of ammo. Enough for a lifetime. Not just 5 years.
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so the anti gun people have figgured out our weak link is ammo supply, i dont think anything ever gets better, only down hill,, i like to go out and shoot a box of 308 or 30-06, or with kids a few boxes of .22,,,i think the days of mag dumps or cutting down a tree with semi 1919a4 are gonna be over with ammo cost an no surplus in sight,, just thinking

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They arent making less ammo. Just more shooters. Eventually they will increase supply if demand stays high. The Dems didnt want millions of new gun owners. This development is long term very positive.

 

Get Biden out of office in 4 years and ammo will be plentiful again when people relax again

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They arent making less ammo. Just more shooters. Eventually they will increase supply if demand stays high. The Dems didnt want millions of new gun owners. This development is long term very positive.

 

Get Biden out of office in 4 years and ammo will be plentiful again when people relax again

At my age, if I feel up to using the TV remote in 4 years I will be happy ... Some of us don't have a lot of time left to wait. In addition to a shortage of affordable ammunition, primers are mostly listed a "out of stock" I just purchased 3 bandoleers of .30 carbine (360 rounds) and paid 0.80 cents a round for it and feel like I made a real score.

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The smart play would be to sell half of my ammo and reloading supplies today at these insane prices (I saw a case of 5,000 Fed. LR GMM primers go for $1,625 plus shipping the other day); and then buy more when the prices go down. My problem is that I don't want to sell anything that I might be able to use. As it stands, I probably have enough ammo for the next 5 years even at pre panic consumption levels and enough components to last for the rest of my foreseeable shooting life. I am short some revolver hunting bullets and a couple types of powder but I have substitutes. I guess I'll survive. Hell, if things stay bad, maybe I'll even finish the primers I bought when Clinton was president. When it is cheap, stack it deep.

 

Dan

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Definitely prices are going to limit the amount I want to shoot.. especially MGs.

However I do believe prices will go down eventually. It's all about supply and demand. Low to medium supply with high demand is causing the prices to be super high.

Eventually demand will die down, causing a surplus.. and the market prices will drop.

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Just got confirmation from sportsmans guide on .45 s&b I pre ordered in September last year. Its all shipping. Enough .45 to make through Biden. Maybe even 2 terms. $295 shipped per case. This is the 2nd batch thats come in. Last one was December I believe.

 

I ordered nutty 9mm from them in September also . None has come in

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Just got confirmation from sportsmans guide on .45 s&b I pre ordered in September last year. Its all shipping. Enough .45 to make through Biden. Maybe even 2 terms. $295 shipped per case. This is the 2nd batch thats come in. Last one was December I believe.

 

I ordered nutty 9mm from them in September also . None has come in

 

I am SO JEALOUS.. I need some 45ACP. SMG don't feed themselves.

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Ive got a few 9mm optics planet preorders too. Not as good prices but much better than $1 a round :)

 

Sportsmans guide 9mm s&b $200 a case shipped- major quantities

Optics planet $400 a case - a few cases

 

Hopefully they come in as I dont think the market gets back to $200 9mm for 2 years minimum

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With all the shortages of ammunition and firearms and we are quick to point to a Democratic conspiracy. But I am more to see a more classic simple supply and demand squeeze. Does not matter if it is toilet paper, germ killer cleaners, petroleum based energy, or "Gunnns and Am-mow" as us gun toting bible thumpers are supposed to say.

 

Demand:

- Increase firearms ownership leads to an increase desire to shoot and in turn an increase demand for ammunition.

- Increase demand caused by scarcity or fear of changes in ownership laws.

 

Normal Inflation:

- General economic changes in the cost of raw material. The economy as a whole.

- As we reopen economy raw materials in general are being effected by cost inflation

 

Supply Chain dynamics

- Covid-19 health mitigation policies. The production of many items are being impacted. The wife and I went to buy some furniture. The furniture is manufactured in South Carolina, production times have gone from 10-12 weeks from order to we don't know when we will have all the parts in. We have run out of certain parts and are waiting on our supplier.

- Factories now maintain shallow level of materials for production and spare parts to keep the line running. Why stock inventory we can get it overnight from ther supplier.

- Component shortages.

 

Now what I think may be the root cause of much of our woes - the bankruptcy of Remington in 2020. This took the inventory that Remington produced in firearms and ammunition out of the supply chain. If I want a semi-auto shotgun, I can no longer find a 1100 or 11-87, so maybe I will look at a Beretta or Bennelli. Or I shoot Remington Yellow Jacket 22LR, and now I can only find Aquila. What impact did this cause?

 

You are starting to hear about shortages in Computer Chip supplies, the factories that make computer chips can't make enough for X-Box's, new cars, airplanes and all the devices that now have chips in them - so there are shortages in every day items and long wait times for smart refrigerators.

 

At the end of the day supply will eventually return to equilibrium in all things, maybe with inflationary pressures. Maybe with government intervention. The government may influence society; as we are seeing with electric cars over gas powered. But at the end of the day, it is a slow transition.

 

Two to three years out, Remington will be back on line and manufacturers will increase production. The world and social norms with change, and a new norm will evolve. But at the end of the day, be prepared. Does not matter if it is toilet paper or ammunition. Keep a ninety day to six month supply of toilet paper and a two year supply of ammunition. Buy by the case, not the round.

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It does not help to know that every time a democrat is put in the oral office, your gun rights and liberties are more eroded than when a republican is put in. If mental illness was really a disqualifer to own a gun, no Biden supporter would be allowed to own on.
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