full auto 45 Posted July 7, 2005 Report Share Posted July 7, 2005 Someone went and messed up a messed up turd. Now this guy wants you to fork over a price of a WWII gun for this shit! Receiver cut to take a drum, a 1928 stock attached to it. If someone buys it at that $17k, they have to pay for shipping and insurance to boot! If you want a WH 1928 pay a few grand less and get one! What will be next, a unknowing police department being told a old 1921 is worth $60 or $70 grand!? WH M1 RIP OFF http://www.subguns.com/classifieds/upload/nfafirearms.6342.1.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philasteen Posted July 7, 2005 Report Share Posted July 7, 2005 GP, looks like it sold. Good for you and laugh all the way to the bank on this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GonePostal Posted July 7, 2005 Report Share Posted July 7, 2005 Hey Mike: Why don't ya just blow me huh? I didn't make the modifications to the gun, they were done way way back in the day when these things went for next to nothing. I got it from another board member here a good time back and need to move several things to fund a real estate purchase. I love the bullshit that I hear from you and Ron about greed but you'd both be the first ones to ask a hefty price for anything in your safe if you needed to sell. No? Ok then list one of yours for below market then. I didn't think so. The gun is priced at market with all the features and accessories, some of which aren't listed in the ad. Don't like the prices? Well take that up with your congressmen because they helped create what we have today which clearly is a pricing scale that anyone with first year economics will tell you is a result of growing demand and fixed supply. I've read with interest some of your posts but don't be an ass and crap over someone else's gun, especially since you'd be the first to lowball a seller. GP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colt21a Posted July 7, 2005 Report Share Posted July 7, 2005 don't involve me in your sale!! and yes i have sold a ton of stuff below market..ask jerry prasser {recon ord} he has bought a ton of stuff from me over the past 20 year's...and made moolah by the ton... let's see along witha few other's here... the original tell it like i see it guy...WOW maybe through rose colored glasses.{not that there is anything wrong with that!!wink! now go do the sale on whatever you are selling and good luck.. and havea nice life.take care,ron Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
full auto 45 Posted July 7, 2005 Author Report Share Posted July 7, 2005 Hey, don't go postal over that I tell it likes I see it. When I sale a gun or anything, I don't gouge the next guy. After all, I'm in it for the fun not to make large amount. Last I sold was my folding semi ak47, I gave $400 for it and sold it for $500. That's not a gouge. Last M1 that was cut up to take a drum sold for around $10k or less. That was listed on subguns I think. That was a few month back. And yes the outrageous prices people are asking today are due to the bullshit laws and demand on the guns. And the tommy parts I have sold, bolt's in wrapper $75, last actuator $75, 5 cell pouch $30. One original 5 cell for $50. And my Colt gun, a double barrel shotgun, near mint shape $600. Sure I make a buck on 'em, but only enough to keep it going and the next guy happy! http://www.machinegunbooks.com/forums/invboard1_1_2/upload/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GonePostal Posted July 7, 2005 Report Share Posted July 7, 2005 (edited) The AO that was listed last week was an one time occurance price wise. Show me another at that price. You know it, I know it and the market knows it. You like alot of folks want to denegrate sales prices unless it's your own in which case it's a totally different story. And the issue at hand is not about parts sales, it's about a transferrable gun. I understand trying to get a good deal and from time to time it does happen that some one will price something remarkably under market but I don't understand shitting all over someone's gun and/or sale because you're upset over climbing prices while secretly rubbing your fingers together over what your's is worth now. That's just not right and shows poor form. You can get as bent as you'd like over the prices but they are what they are and it's due to no fault of mine. As for you being in it for fun, that all well and fine as for the most part so I am. I don't own museum pieces and I shoot everything I've got. Just because we're in it for the fun doesn't mean you're going to sell me either one of your two Thompsons at less than what they are commanding right now. Apologies to Ron if he got a little torqued as I didn't mean to slam him. It's just that he's another always throwing that GREED word around a little too loosely for my taste and it's a little much at times. Regardless, it's now a moot point as market has spoken and gun is sold. GP Edited July 10, 2005 by GonePostal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Fliegenheimer Posted July 7, 2005 Report Share Posted July 7, 2005 GonePostal, It is of course great to know that the free market system is alive and well in the U.S. and enterprising folks can make profits on their hobbies and investments. But if you believe the AO that sold last week for a "low" figure was an aberration then your $17K price for a shooter WH with after thought modifications must also be an aberration. But how did you arrive at the $17K figure? There was a WWII "rare" AO M1 TSMG that sold for a silly $19,500 a few weeks ago. Is a replica TSMG with a drum modification worth $2500 less than that an original WWII M1 that wasn't ever rebuilt/upgraded to an M1A1? One would think a NFA buyer would start subtracting value from a modified TSMG, even a WH version. Now you found a buyer for your WH who is willing to pay $17K for the full auto component. Since WH M1's can be had much closer to the $10K figure, as Devlin accurately assessed, your price does raise eyebrows and incredulity. If indeed someone did immediately pony up your asking price, that doesn't mean they paid the going rate. But it does mean that they are horribly uneducated about TSMG's and the NFA market in general. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GonePostal Posted July 7, 2005 Report Share Posted July 7, 2005 QUOTE "But how did you arrive at the $17K figure?" Gee I don't know. Perhaps it was a scan of a couple of listings like: http://www.subguns.com/classifieds/index.c...query=retrieval and this: http://www.sturmgewehr.com/webBBS/nfa4sale....cgi?read=60795 And calculating what it would cost to send a WH off to someone like PK for all this work that's been done to get accomplished. Did I place a premium on this? Sure thing, but last time I looked, Lionhart is correct in that the seller is free to set whatever price he or she is willing to part with it for. Personally the gun is so nice and I liked it so much that I decided I wouldn't part with it for nothing less then I listed it for. I feel that it's inappropriate for someone to disparage another board member's sale but hey since you and Mike prolly share then agenda of trying to get some poor sap to accept the market pricing is lower then what it is I guess I can see what all the fuss is about. Anytime you want to sell those WH guns for.....what was it???? $10K, just let me and the others know because we'd all be happy to send you checks overnight. Somehow me thinks I should not hold my breath waiting for that PM or email that tells me you want to sell your WH for that price http://www.machinegunbooks.com/forums/invboard1_1_2/upload/html/emoticons/laugh.gif You're free to feel holier than thou and "above me" for not pricing your stuff at top dollar but rest assured I won't feel the slightest bit guilty as I sip my sweet tea on the deck of my recently purchased summer lake home courtesy of some hard earned dollars added to funds collected from the sale of several of my prized MGs. As for the buyer, well he'll be as happy as I was when I finally did drum dumps in the gun that I forked out what was big bucks when I bought it and in two years he'll have the same higher equity in it that I had in it yesterday before I sold. I only hope he can deal with the BS that will come from the peanut gallery if and when he attempts to make a few bucks by selling it. QUOTE "There was a WWII "rare" AO M1 TSMG that sold for a silly $19,500 a few weeks ago." Wow, I guess that the market has tanked for WWII Bridgeport, Savage and AOC guns huh? NOT!!! Somebody should tell these guys that they need to relist theirs for 17 or 19k respectively instead. Hey, how about you and Mike take that job on of calling and explaining why they need to lower their prices. http://www.machinegunbooks.com/forums/invboard1_1_2/upload/html/emoticons/tongue.gif http://www.sturmgewehr.com/webBBS/nfa4sale....cgi?read=61323 http://www.gunsamerica.com/guns/976579516.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norm Posted July 7, 2005 Report Share Posted July 7, 2005 Hey guys, We should keep in mind the the person that bought this weapon is probably trolling the board for info (or maybe even a member!) Arthur F. is right, it is a free market and someone thought enough of the gun that the $17,000 price tag was justified. Maybe the guy was a first time buyer that has been beat out of few Tommys in the past, so he jumped on this one. Other people have asked for higher-than-market amounts on other WH guns. GP just happen to get what he asked for, and that is fair. If the guy who bought the gun is reading this, I say "Enjoy your gun. Shoot it often, and enjoy the feeling of full-auto fun and welcome to the board." I do see points on both sides of the issue. It is an altered WH M1, but it (the drum slots and 28 stock mount) were done before GP got it. I think it's an intresting Thompson. Why someone would do it is anyone's guess. I think it was done in the late 80's before the prices were so high and a WH guns were veiwed as "modifyable without effecting the value." Does anyone remember way back before the 86 ban when only Colt M16s were considered acceptable? Any other brand of M16 was veiwed as almost second rate or even unacceptable; man how the times have changed! GP, can you tell me what that short silver colored object is above the two barrels? Just my $.02..... Norm http://www.machinegunbooks.com/forums/invboard1_1_2/upload/html/emoticons/blink.gif PS: I have gotten some GREAT deals from Ron....wink! PPS: LIONHART, QUOTE Man has the right to ask anything he want's. Yeah, 17K is a bit high. I don't know. I'd say 11K would be closer to it's value, considering the Modifications. This is true, unless your city hall wants you to give your house up so a Starbucks can be built there! http://www.machinegunbooks.com/forums/invboard1_1_2/upload/html/emoticons/ohmy.gif Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
full auto 45 Posted July 7, 2005 Author Report Share Posted July 7, 2005 QUOTE Man has the right to ask anything he want's. Yeah, 17K is a bit high. I don't know. I'd say 11K would be closer to it's value, considering the Modifications. WH GUN - $11K WH DRUM- $300 FINNED BARREL- $225 SMOOTH BARREL - $195 EXTRA SET OF WOOD- $50 BLANK ADAPTER- ? $50-$100? FAIR VALUE OF A WH M1- $11870 MAYBE $12.5K GP DIDN'T INTEND TO PISS YOU OFF. http://www.machinegunbooks.com/forums/invboard1_1_2/upload/html/emoticons/wink.gif Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalbert Posted July 7, 2005 Report Share Posted July 7, 2005 Just my 2 cents, but maybe the person who bought the weapon wanted a C&R gun. They paid what they were willing to pay for it. David Albert dalbert@sturmgewehr.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Posted July 7, 2005 Report Share Posted July 7, 2005 Norm, It's the barrel for the suppressor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Fliegenheimer Posted July 7, 2005 Report Share Posted July 7, 2005 QUOTE I feel that it's inappropriate for someone to disparage another board member's sale but hey since you and Mike prolly share then agenda of trying to get some poor sap to accept the market pricing is lower then what it is I guess I can see what all the fuss is about. Anytime you want to sell those WH guns for.....what was it???? $10K, just let me and the others know because we'd all be happy to send you checks overnight. GP, The following TSMG's are currently for sale here: http://www.westernfirearms.com/wfc ...Since you are in a hurry to buy TSMG's in the $10K range, they will taker your CC over the phone. We will look forward to seeing pics of your new M1A1 on the board. Model: M1A1 Cash Price: $10,500.00 50/50 Payments: $10,995.00 Status: In Stock, Form 3 Model: 1928A1 Cash Price: $19,995.00 50/50 Payments: $20,995.00 Status: In Stock, Form 3 Model: 1928 Commemorative Cash Price: $18,500.00 50/50 Payments: $18,995.00 Status: In Stock, Form 3 Notice that one can still buy a stock C&R WH 1928 TSMG that takes a drum for under $19K and WWII 1928's for under $20K and an unmolested WH M1 for.........not $17K.....not $15K...not $12K....but $10,500! Would your buyer have passed up a Savage 28A1 TSMG for two grand more and the option to pay half down/half on delivery (did you offer that?) in favor of your WH Frankenstein? The ads you posted are sellers floating trial balloons. Who knows what they will eventually settle for if they sell at all. Let us not confuse some knee jerk lay down buyer with the rest of the NFA market. You bent the poor fellow over. It happens everyday. If he/she keeps this WH for another five years they will still see the then current prices for WH modified M1's in their rear view mirror. I do not know what PK charges to alter a WH M1 receiver to accept a drum, but $5K it ain't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GonePostal Posted July 8, 2005 Report Share Posted July 8, 2005 Suggest you actually CALL Nick before you use his site listings to make a fool out of yourself. I've spoken to him recently and many of his guns sell so fast that he can't keep up with updating the board. Oh and that M1A1 Thompson which you so gleefully pointed out (thinking AH HA, I've GOT HIM!) is at 10k, it's in fact a PRE DEALER SAMPLE. Bwaahahahaha. http://www.machinegunbooks.com/forums/invboard1_1_2/upload/html/emoticons/laugh.gif You want so very much to be "right" on an issue that frankly is none of your damned business. Do you really have so little of a life that you'd allow this sort of back and forth exchange to consume you? I'm playing along and laughing only because of how often we've all seen you get into these petty "I told you so" retard arguments, like the time you went up against Bubba Naess on the sturm board just recently about some Thompson related topic that clearly you were WAY over your head on. Your lack of board etiquette showed then when you were being spanked by him and it shows now. Go find some n00b to tell how great and knowledgeable you are because you are transparent to me & now unfortunately for you, to several others on this otherwise fine board. I'll end with a fitting quote from Forrest Gump - QUOTE "And that's all I have to say about that." GP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Jr Posted July 8, 2005 Report Share Posted July 8, 2005 Finally an interesting post on the board. http://www.machinegunbooks.com/forums/invboard1_1_2/upload/html/emoticons/ph34r.gif Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Fliegenheimer Posted July 8, 2005 Report Share Posted July 8, 2005 GP & Big D His ads say Form III for all of the TSMG's listed sold and unsold. The click on pics for more detail was not functioning when I last looked. Regardless if you throw out the dealer sample $10.5K M1, the others are still a way better bargain than $17K for a WH M1. To now argue what is still available and what is sold is absurd. The TSMG ads you posted are indeed still for sale while the Western Firearms ads not marked "SOLD" must also be taken at face value. GP, Who is Bubba Naess and what are you talking about? If you are in constant communication with Nick about his TSMG sales, then I'm sure he is as amazed as anyone here that you found a buyer who submitted to your price on your TSMG when he still has his comparative bargain WWII and 1928 models for sale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Jr Posted July 8, 2005 Report Share Posted July 8, 2005 Nick Tillota has a great TSMG collection. His website is so outdated its unreal. http://www.westernfirearms.com/wfc/browning?set=10 That was my 1919 that I had for a year and a half and sold over a year ago. I never even dealt with Tillota on the deal, just the owner directly off a WTB ad. I called him and we talked Thompsons and he said he would get it off the website. Its STILL THERE. At least it now shows sold, as when I called him it showed for sale still and it had already been xfered TWICE. NO TELLING how old his ads are. Jr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Posted July 8, 2005 Report Share Posted July 8, 2005 Later dudes http://www.machinegunbooks.com/forums/invboard1_1_2/upload/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jim Posted July 8, 2005 Report Share Posted July 8, 2005 Way to go Gone Postal!!! Boy, now I feel like my buyer stole my RARE(non-rebuilt) AOC M1 Thompson for 19.5k!! Oh well, I'm one of the respectable DEALERS that won't back out on a deal once it's done. I guess I'm not GREEDY enough when it comes to Thompsons. P.S. I like the way you nailed Mike to the wall, I couldn't have worded it better myself Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waffen Und Bier Posted July 9, 2005 Report Share Posted July 9, 2005 Hey guys. It's the same way with Florida real estate. Values in this area have gone up double triple quadruple in just the past couple of years. Sucks, but if ya want the property, ya pay or someone else will quickly. I don't begrudge anyone making money on something that's theirs. I see plenty of guns on the internet or at shows that have been messed with, or are too high. I pass them by. I've sold guns (including several machineguns) to friends and acquaintances, friends of friends, coworkers, guys at the range, fraternal and business organization comembers, etc. for much less than market price - discounts of 15-20% and by the time the transfer went through, it was even more of a discount, but by the same token, should I ever need to extract top dollar out of something, I won't feel bad either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roland, Headless Thompson Gunner Posted July 9, 2005 Report Share Posted July 9, 2005 Was Mike out of line for calling GP's gun a turd? Yeah that was probably a cheap shot. Was GP within his right to ask 17K for a WH hybrid? Sure. Was Mike wrong to question the worth of said gun? No, of course not. I think one of the primary functions of this board is, or it should be, to provide pricing guidance to any potential Thompson buyer and to help all of us understand the current market forces. How many posts have started out with "What is the current value of..." As I said in an earlier post, It be great if we could keep track of actual exchanges, not just the SPF for asking price we see in the archives. I bought a WH 28 in April 2004 for 10K. It sat on subguns for some time before I got around to calling the guy to see if it was still available. He said he had had a lot of interest but no takers. At that same time I passed on two NIB WH 28s for 12K. I recently purchased a Savage M1 for 15K. I'm sure the guy paying 17K for a modified WH M1 with some extra parts would have liked to know that. I can also Tell you that our buddy DT in PA was asking 19.5 for a WH M1 at last months gunshow. (It is a C&R afterall!) I jumped on my M1, was it a good deal, not at this time last year but I'm happy now. But I got to say, when it comes to buying a West Hurley, your buying a receiver. We all know what the first two pieces of advice you get upon making public your acquistion, and say it with me: 1) replace all the WH parts with a GI issue parts kit, and 2) Send it off to Pk for tweaking. Should West Hurley receivers command the same prices as Savage or AO guns? Not unless you find the description "all parts are original WH" a plus. In my worthless opinion anyway. My beer is getting warm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Z3BigDaddy Posted July 9, 2005 Report Share Posted July 9, 2005 RHTG, I'll second everything you said excluding drinkin the warm beer... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
full auto 45 Posted July 9, 2005 Author Report Share Posted July 9, 2005 QUOTE Was Mike out of line for calling GP's gun a turd? Yeah that was probably a cheap shot. Sorry I called your gun a turd......................... QUOTE I can also Tell you that our buddy DT in PA was asking 19.5 for a WH M1 at last months gunshow I saw it listed on subguns for $14k today. He listed it on 6/1 looks like subgun linky Remember when it was fun to go to a gun show so you could get a deal on something? Now you go there and be lucky to hear a thank you from somebody. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Jr Posted July 9, 2005 Report Share Posted July 9, 2005 Dennis Todd is also asking 11,500 for an M2 carbine. Now we are talking absurd for a real turd. http://www.machinegunbooks.com/forums/invboard1_1_2/upload/html/emoticons/laugh.gif Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merry Ploughboy Posted July 9, 2005 Report Share Posted July 9, 2005 Sear packs for HKs are going for $13K, RDIASs and RLLs for ARs are going at over $12K - makes a genuine WH M1 receiver a bargain at $17K! MP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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