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What Happened to all the Thompsons After WW2?


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Just when I was graduating high school I bought a book titled "Arsenal of Democracy, American Weapons Available for Export" By Tom Gervasi

 

Here is a review of it:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/entertainment/books/1978/08/27/arsenal-of-democracy-american-weapons-available-for-export-by-tom-gervasi/c8e23389-306f-4d8b-8e71-722c9421f76b/?utm_term=.240679d640c6

 

The book not only describes the weapons systems, it documents who we gave them to or sold them to.

I haven't opened the covers for some time, but I know it lists who received Thompsons and how many each country was provided.

 

Richard

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Half got turned into parts kits, Half ended up in the Pacific and the Atlantic Oceans,Half had gotten burned & destroyed battle damaged. and half of the last half are still running around on the planet still functioning.

 

I think at this point I ran out of Thompson's. But hey the important one is the one or two you have and own.

 

Who cares what the other half doe's. Colt21aRon

p.s. and we can have this same old tale on another ten guns during the war. And it has been hashed on since WW2, what Happened to the 12 Million K-98s' and the 5 million 45 auto's and on and on..

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This is a really interesting topic and I find it kind of funny that it never occurred to me before.

 

What the heck did happen to all those Thompsons? bottom of the sea? smelter? warehouse in greece?

 

we collectors and US police forces are holding a tiny fraction of the total production.

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There were also thousands sent to the bottom of the north Atlantic by german Uboats.There were staggering amounts of military equipment lost that way in the early years of the war but our great manufacturing might just made more.

 

Tom Davis Jr. (TD.) Great Britain - The Tommy Gun Story book has the documented number of shipping losses by U-boats. Not as Thompson's at the bottom of the Atlantic as everyone had speculated.

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This is a really interesting topic and I find it kind of funny that it never occurred to me before.

 

What the heck did happen to all those Thompsons? bottom of the sea? smelter? warehouse in greece?

 

we collectors and US police forces are holding a tiny fraction of the total production.

Buzz,

Yes, yes, and yes. It is pretty amazing, isn't it? And not just for Thompsons! As Colt21aRon points out, so many other weapons too, and not limited to the USA. Add BARs, mess kits, 60mm mortars, the list is endless. There have to be many storehouses, warehouses, ship-sized containers etc. all over this country and the world filled with treasures. Local lore has it (western Nebraska) that the US Army, in the dead of night, buried countless tons of .30 and .50 ammo along with M1 carbines, Browning M2s, in ravines southwest of McCook. The really old boys around there say it's true but are not providing any coordinates. So there's another scenario.

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There is always a story about some veteran that dies and their kids find a gun, grenade or something hidden in the Garage. There is a book on the Thompson cannot think of the name (blue Cover) that while in France researching the book, a number of people showed him Thompsons and other guns that were not turn in after the war, in case France was invaded again.

In England an Woman died who had been in MI-6 during the war, and she still had her Sten Gun in the attic.

I am sure many more will start turning up as the veterans get fewer from that war.

Edited by Paladin601
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As noted above, a lot of U.S. materiel went to "allies" at the time. I know that both Turkey and Israel received Thompsons, mags and parts. The unfortunate turn of event in China did bring those back in our face in Korea, along with some that were made in China.

 

When the Turks were supporting the Turkish Cypriots during the civil war on Cyprus, they carefully provided only select Thompson parts, requiring the Turrks to manufacture the rest of the guns locally. Initially the guns were made in brass, but they switched to steel when the brass versions couldn't hold up over time. Providing complete weapons would have angered both the U.S. and U.N., who had peacekeeping forces there in the late 60's and early 70's.

 

We have seen a number of Thompson XX magazines that are marked as being officially part of the Israeli military. Most were green parkerized, but some were left blued.

 

Roger

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When talking about guns, one must be careful to separate actual facts from gun shop factoids.

 

The Thompson M1A1 weighs 10.6 lbs empty and the MP40 weighs 8.8 lbs empty.

 

I'm sure the extra 1.8 lbs made the soldier's arms pull right out of the sockets.

 

You hear a lot of people blah-blah-ing about this gun being better than that gun, but it's mostly just gun shop bubba talk.

Don't know about you, but a "loaded" Thompson and a "loaded" MP40 each with "loaded" (unless you have a habit of carrying unloaded weapons around) extra magazines, well, the difference is significant and I would rather "by far" carry an MP40 and kit than a Thompson. Plus it is a far handier weapon with the collapsible stock. I own both, am not by most counts a "weeny" either (bench over 350), but I can honestly tell. The Thompson is NOT a handy gun by any means. And besides, you are immensely undergunned with either a 9mm or a .45 so that part REALLY MAKES NO DIFFERENCE.

 

I love my 28. Fun gun to shoot. Really it is. But if I had to carry one or the other into battle, the first thing I would do is curse my luck at having to carry either one, then reach over and pick up the MP40.

 

Your mileage may vary.

 

To compare to a Garand is beyond pointless. With a Garand you can actually kill stuff on a consistent basis.

 

FWIW I shot a racoon last night with the Thompson. I shot him 6 times before he quite moving forward. 230gr .45 acp fmj hardball. Now as a given, coons are tough as snot. Probably tougher than I am as far as getting shot. But still. anytime someone tries to tell me a .45 is so much better than a 9mm it is just almost an instant giggle on my part. Both suck so hard it is completely pointless to argue.

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A lot of times when gun collectors compare similar guns, they pick over small differences between the guns.

 

And then the differences are played up to an extreme degree.

 

The whole conversation does not conform to any historical information from actual combat use.

 

For example, you might see some thread where 1911s are compared to P38s.

 

The people in the thread will make very exaggerated statements about the guns like "The 1911 was TOTALLY OBSOLETE by WWII and COMPLETELY OUTCLASSED by the P38."

 

But in truth, these little differences have zero effect on the use of the guns in combat.

 

If you equipped the US troops with P38s and MP40s and the Germans with Thompsons and 1911s, it would not have made the tiniest little scrap of a difference in the outcome of any battle.

 

That's my point.

 

The internet is littered with threadS where guys are making dramatic statements about this gun or that gun and those statements have nothing to do with the actual use of the gun in combat.

 

My craftsman screw drivers are TOTALLY OUTCLASSED by snap-on screwdrivers but I have never encountered a screw I couldn't tighten or loosen with with craftsman screwdrivers, even though the snap-on screwdrivers are A HUNDRED MILLION TIMES MORE ERGONOMIC.

Edited by buzz
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If you equipped the US troops with P38s and MP40s and the Germans with Thompsons and 1911s, it would not have made the tiniest little scrap of a difference in the outcome of any battle.

But if you equipped U.S. troops with Mauser K98 and Krauts with M1 Garand ( "the greatest battle implement ever devised"*) your declaration falls flat.

 

* Gen. Patton

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The Germans had to be better shots a five shot bolt action.. They did not have to worry on spray and pray until issued the K-43 G-43 and MP-44 ask any living WW 2German Vet today. He will tell you.

 

If you have both. you can enjoy the best. And the P-38 like the Hi-Power great stuff. heck its History.

 

Colt 21A Ron

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If you read commentary about guns, even in books, you get lead up some blind alleys.

 

A lot of information is just stories that went back and forth for decades.

 

Most people will quickly believe a story that romantic or interesting, and they ignore the boring version that is actually the truth.

 

Unless you can verify a story, you shouldn't believe it too much.

 

I know a gentleman, who is 101 years old now. His name is Albin Irzyk and hes written four books. He retired from the army as a Brigidar General and during World War II he was a Lt. Col. Commanding Combat Command B of the 4th Armored Division. He received the Distinguished Service Cross, several silver stars and two Purple Hearts during World War II. He saw a lot of combat. Ive sat down with him many times in his home and listened to his stories. He says during World War II no one complained about the Sherman tanks. Everyone thought they were great. Did they have issues? Yes, but doesnt everthing have its issues? He said everyone loved the Sherman tank up until the 1970s when another veteran Belton Cooper wrote a book called "Death Traps" that everyone began hating on the Sherman and its become commonplace to distain that tank. I could tell several stories of his enumerating why the Sherman was superior to the German counter parts (too many to type up here though) but after that book, they were damned and everyone jumped on the bandwagon of the Sherman was horrible. Another case of people who werent there making up a reality thats get taken as truth.

 

 

 

 

This is a really interesting topic and I find it kind of funny that it never occurred to me before.

 

What the heck did happen to all those Thompsons? bottom of the sea? smelter? warehouse in greece?

 

we collectors and US police forces are holding a tiny fraction of the total production.

Buzz,

Yes, yes, and yes. It is pretty amazing, isn't it? And not just for Thompsons! As Colt21aRon points out, so many other weapons too, and not limited to the USA. Add BARs, mess kits, 60mm mortars, the list is endless. There have to be many storehouses, warehouses, ship-sized containers etc. all over this country and the world filled with treasures. Local lore has it (western Nebraska) that the US Army, in the dead of night, buried countless tons of .30 and .50 ammo along with M1 carbines, Browning M2s, in ravines southwest of McCook. The really old boys around there say it's true but are not providing any coordinates. So there's another scenario.

In my town, there was an Army Air Base that trained pilots. After the war was over allegedly there were many surplus things... jeeps, Air plane engines, etc. some of it was taken to a hole and dump in and covered up and the rest taken to the ocean and dumped a few miles off shore. One of the guys I used to work with his brother in law was there when they pushed all these surplus items into the pit and covered them up. Today, there is a college dorm built on the site. Edited by Kilroy
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If you equipped the US troops with P38s and MP40s and the Germans with Thompsons and 1911s, it would not have made the tiniest little scrap of a difference in the outcome of any battle.

But if you equipped U.S. troops with Mauser K98 and Krauts with M1 Garand ( "the greatest battle implement ever devised"*) your declaration falls flat.

 

* Gen. Patton

 

 

No kidding, Arthur.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man

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buzz, on 06 Mar 2017 - 00:18, said:

 

When everyone's thinking alike, then nobody is thinking.

https://en.wikipedia...ity_experiments

 

"Wikipedia is like an old and eccentric uncle.

He can be a lot of fun—over the years he's seen a lot, and he can tell a great story. He's also no dummy; he's accumulated a lot of information and has some strong opinions about what he's gathered. You can learn quite a bit from him. But take everything he says with a grain of salt. A lot of the things he thinks he knows for sure aren't quite right, or are taken out of context. And when it comes down to it, sometimes he believes things that are a little bit, well, nuts."

 

Charles Seife (2014). Virtual Unreality: Just Because the Internet Told You, how Do You Know It's True?. Penguin Publishing Group.

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buzz, on 06 Mar 2017 - 00:18, said:

 

When everyone's thinking alike, then nobody is thinking.

https://en.wikipedia...ity_experiments

"Wikipedia is like an old and eccentric uncle.

He can be a lot of funover the years he's seen a lot, and he can tell a great story. He's also no dummy; he's accumulated a lot of information and has some strong opinions about what he's gathered. You can learn quite a bit from him. But take everything he says with a grain of salt. A lot of the things he thinks he knows for sure aren't quite right, or are taken out of context. And when it comes down to it, sometimes he believes things that are a little bit, well, nuts."

 

Charles Seife (2014). Virtual Unreality: Just Because the Internet Told You, how Do You Know It's True?. Penguin Publishing Group.

Very appropriate and absolutely made me laugh out loud for multiple reasons.

 

Ron

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My guess there are still many unregistered Thompsons out there, for the same reason that if they had a gun registration now, many would not register them. I had an very well known authority on the Thompson, tell that he believe that there are more full auto guns now in Civilian hands then before Reagan's ban. I believe him.

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