Tungsten Action Bar to Slow Down the Reising?

[huggytree]

is it possible to make a tungsten action bar and turn the reising into a 600-650 rpm subgun ?

 

with the CFW bolts for the mac i had a friend ask why it couldnt be done for the reising?

 

seems like there are thousands of reisings out there...an extremely common gun ...enough of a market for something after market ?

 

 

[emmagee1917]

I guess you could cut down a damaged stock and attach lead or metal weights to the bar and check the RPM difference . Once you know the weight you need for the rate you want , use water displacement to get your bar's volume and see how tungsten compares .

Chris

[huggytree]

im not sure how custom fit the action bar is on the reising? i know the bolt would be hopeless to change due to custom fitting that would be needed

 

an interesting way to make the Reising into possibly a better shooter

[Springman]

Found this Huggy

[StrangeRanger]

That "successful" version needed way more mass added than could practically be achieved by making a tungsten action bar. Tungsten weighs 2.5X what steel does but the action bar doesn't weigh all that much to start with. When you start playing around with changing reciprocating masses, you have to play with spring rates as well. The whole thing is likely to become a trip down a rabbit hole. Think about how badly Gunmachines screwed up trying to speed up TSMGs; slowing down is equally difficult. Tungsten works in very simple guns like a MAC because the new bolt just a big heavy lump that replaces a significantly lighter lump. One moving part, fairly easy to come up with the needed spring rate to balance it out. The Reising is many things but simple is not one of them.

 

FWIW I had an exchange of e-mails on exactly this subject with a gunsmith member of this board. His considered opinion was that there was no practical way to slow a Reising down. It's not my place to paraphrase him but if he sees this he may jump in and add some expertise.

[huggytree]

thanks for the video and the info above.......it would be an interesting product if someone could do it

[StrangeRanger]

There's one change you might want to play with if you have money to throw at the project (I considered this one myself but decided it wasn't worth the effort and expense.) The Reising hammer sears up and releases with every shot in the full auto mode. If you made the hammer out of tungsten, it would take about 60% more time from when it was released to when it impacts the firing pin. The increase in mass would have only a very minor effect in increasing the time it takes for the delayed blowback to drive the combined mass of bolt, hammer and action bar to the rear and none whatsoever on the time it takes for the bolt to return to battery and release the sear. The hammer release-to-impact is a very small part of the total cycle and the overall ROF reduction in return would be minor. The increase in load on the bolt during rearward travel would be significant and since it is a known weak spot, that might present a durability problem - another reason I gave up on the idea

[jl7422]

Most Reising owners are happy to have one that runs reliably at any speed. . .

[PTRS-14.5]

Increasing the reciprocating mass will undoubtedly effect the structural and component life of the MG. The internals of these guns are not forgiving in any sense and in my opinion not of the best design to start with... Why go there?

 

PTRS

Edited December 27, 2018 by PTRS-14.5

[vern21]

Believe it or not, my M50 runs flawlessly with my 185 gr SWC reloads at around 550 rpm. GI ball runs at over 800. Same mags and everything. I had not intended to shoot SWCs but since that was my 1911 practice ammo, I figured Id give them a try. Its great having only one reloading setup.

 

Jim

[GUNGUY45]

Vern, are they lead Swc?

If so how bad do they "lead up" the comp.

I tried 230 gr lead rn in the Reising & quit very soon after due to the lead build up in the comp.

[vern21]

I use Bayou Bullets 185 gr lead SWC with 4.5 gr of Clays. They are coated and produce very low smoke and very little leading in the comp. Not the cheapest lead cast bullets, but they run in every .45 ACP I own including 1911, the Reising, and a S&W Shield. The 185 gr weight saves a little. As I said above, I used the loads in my pistols, and tried them in my Reising M50 when I received it on a lark. I couldnt believe how well they ran. Ive fired thousands without a hitch.

 

Jim

Edited December 29, 2018 by vern21

[PTRS-14.5]

I all regards, this sounds to be the best solution for running these guns! Thx for your input.

 

PTRS

[jim c 351]

Rainier and Berry both make 185 gr plated bullets.

Looks like the solution is at hand and problems over with.

Jim C

[Grasshopper]

Dear Vern21,

 

Thanks for your load input. Just curious. What is the OAL of your loaded cartridge with the 185 SWC's? I normally run 1.25" for my target loads.

 

Awhile back there was a shooter up in the Florida Panhandle running light loads in his Reising. He had also mounted about a 2X Weaver on the M50. He also had very good luck with function and accuracy.

 

I guess it is time to give it a try.

 

Grasshopper

[vern21]

Grasshopper,

 

With the Bayou Bullets the OAL is 1.270 inches. Not sure if all 185 gr SWC are profiled the same, so you may have to adjust a bit.

 

Jim

[StrangeRanger]

FWIW the Berry's 185 gr. HBRN bullets are hollow base just like a Civil War Minié ball. They are designed to load to the same OAL as 230 hardball

 

https://www.berrysmfg.com/item/bp-45-452-185gr-hbrn

[DGinGA]

Did an experiment today. I bought a box of 185 grain ammo to see if it changed the cyclic rate. It definitely slowed the rate down. Once I figure out how to measure cyclic rate, real numbers will be posted. Unexpectedly, the gun ran perfectly. Next step is to load some rounds at 850 or so FPS.

[StrangeRanger]

Use a shot timer like the ones used in UDPSA or IDPA matches. It will give you time to shot for each shot. Subtract and you get time between shots. The inverse times 60 gives the cyclic rate in RPM