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#21 engine31

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Posted 28 January 2004 - 01:27 PM

Thats OK, just want to know what I have. Would it then be a 1928?
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#22 engine31

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Posted 28 January 2004 - 01:28 PM

I also have serial 452679. Any info on that?
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#23 engine31

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Posted 28 January 2004 - 01:42 PM

The "NO" are both caps with a period. FULL AUTO. is on one line with a period at the end. So do you think this is 1928 AO?
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#24 Arthur Fliegenheimer

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Posted 28 January 2004 - 01:46 PM

Engine,
I think we are closing in on it. Yes.

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#25 engine31

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Posted 28 January 2004 - 01:48 PM

What about 452679? Thanks for the help. Paul
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#26 Arthur Fliegenheimer

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Posted 28 January 2004 - 01:51 PM

Engine,
Probably made somewhere around March, 1942.

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#27 gijive

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Posted 28 January 2004 - 01:53 PM

Engine31,

Your other frame with the 452679 serial number should have a letter prefix of either "S" or "AO." If it doesn't, then it may have grind marks where the original number was and a new number stamped. The serial number range is that of a Savage made 1928A1 Thompson and my guess is that the Full Auto markings on this one will be on two lines. Some guns, when rebuilt, had the original serial number removed from the frame and restamped to match the receiver they were being placed on. The S or AO prefix was usually not stamped when the frames were renumbered.

On your other frame when you say you lay it on it's left side and the grip facing towards you, do you mean the finger groove part of the grip facing toward the right? If that's the case, then the number isn't stamped correctly for an Auto-Ordnance made frame. If the grip frame is placed with the flat side down (the side that mates with the receiver) the AO prefaced serial number should read left to right starting at the rear of the wood grip and continuing toward the frame latch recess. I believe the Colt serial numbers are stamped this way also, but I don't have a reference at hand while I am typing this.

The Savage S prefaced numbers should start at the frame latch recess end of the frame and read left to right towards the rear of the wooden grip. I am doing this from memory so I apologize up front for any errors.
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#28 engine31

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Posted 28 January 2004 - 02:11 PM

My apologies for not being able to post images of this frame. When the lower is placed on the slide portion (where the reciever attaches) and the finger grooves pointing to the right the numbers read from left to right. Or they start from the reiever latch area and read toward the grip. This scenario is also true for the other frame. On that one there is evidence that serial number was removed and replaced. There are no letter prefixes, just 452679. FULL AUTO is also "stacked" on the 452679 lower. This lower was purchased on E-Bay about 6 months ago and was attached to a dummy reciever. It is a "complete" dummy gun. Thanks. Paul
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#29 engine31

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Posted 28 January 2004 - 02:14 PM

The lower stamped NO. 4023 has no other letters prefacing these.
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#30 gijive

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Posted 28 January 2004 - 02:44 PM

Engine31,

Thanks for the clarification, I thought that is what you meant.

Since the Full Auto is on one line and the number has no AO preceeding it, my guess is that someone took an aftermarket WWII frame, engraved a number on it and had it refinished. The aftermarket WWII frames had no serial number engraved on them.

The other frame is, I believe, a Savage made 1928A1 frame that was rebuilt during a government rebuild program during WWII and had the frame renumbered to match the receiver it was being placed on. The serial number range would be consistent with Savage made 1928A1 Thompsons and the Full Auto on two lines indicates Savage manufacture. The later rebuilt 1928A1 guns did not have the serial number ground off and mismatched frame and receiver numbers are common.

I hope this helps. When you are able to, post pictures.
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#31 engine31

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Posted 28 January 2004 - 02:51 PM

Thanks GI Jive. Given what you now know about this frame what would you recommend as far as restoration with a Richardson reciever. What reciever markings would you go with? Paul
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#32 gijive

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Posted 28 January 2004 - 04:24 PM

Engine31,

It's your call, obviously, but I think I would go for an early A.O. made 1928A1 Thompson. The Full Auto markings on one line are consistent with the A.O. guns and that aspect is more visible than the serial number which will he hidden by the butt stock anyway.

On the other hand, if you wish to make it look like a Colt gun, the serial number range is correct, but the markings aren't. You might have more difficulty locating the knurled selector switches to make it look like a Colt gun, although PK can take the existing ones and make them look like the Colt type. Finding an early magazine catch release lever without the hole in the center is another matter.

I might opt for the early A.O. 1928A1, but it's up to you. Either one would be nice, I'm sure.
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#33 PK.

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Posted 28 January 2004 - 06:55 PM

FWIW

The hole in the mag catch can be welded and the checkering re-cut to make it look like a Colt mag catch.

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#34 engine31

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Posted 28 January 2004 - 07:12 PM

Thanks FWIW, Paul
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