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Colt Thompsons Between S/n 15000 And 15040


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#1 TD.

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Posted 01 March 2004 - 12:43 PM

Arthur made a comment on Thompson S/N 14391 in the string by Uncle Dudley about the higher serial number Colt Thompsons. (Again, nice Thompson Uncle Dudley) Every Thompson book or reference I own or have read states the Colt production Thompson began at S/N 41 and ended at S/N 15040. I recall talking to Roger Cox many years ago about the higher number Colt Thompsons and he told me that at least one 15000 Colt was sold in the United States. I asked him the normal follow-up questions, but he politely refused to tell me who purchased it (or where it was located). We have some long time advanced Thompson collectors on this board. Has anyone ever seen a Colt Thompson with a 15000 serial number? Or even a picture of one? Thanks, Tom
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#2 colt21a

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Posted 01 March 2004 - 12:58 PM

well i will chime in>>>>> NO.................i have had 14xxx,and 147xx and 146xx

and even in rogers book he stops at 14987..and later in the supplement he does not go beyond that.

yes i would like to see one.i am not sure anybody has.......and i am sure if roger did,he would have documented who had it.he was very good with numbers on these thing's.......and did not make that many mistake's...............

remember he was the first who even bothered to do it.........not even the early fifties collector's........{ all just about deceased by now}unless they are age 80 and over......

yes number #41 {i think colt still has it}or in the collection in ct.and #15040 would make a nice set........

now that would be worth $100,000...did i just say that?????
wink!! Ron
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#3 Arthur Fliegenheimer

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Posted 01 March 2004 - 03:48 PM

TD,
When Eye-Anna-Me-Co was doing a search of serial numbers advertised on the net years ago, he apparently had a response from an anonymous owner who claimed they had #15004.... Other than that type of Nessie sighting,,,Zip.

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#4 colt21a

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Posted 01 March 2004 - 05:21 PM

QUOTE (Arthur Fliegenheimer @ Mar 1 2004, 03:48 PM)
TD,
When Eye-Anna-Me-Co was doing a search of serial numbers advertised on the net years ago, he apparently had a response from an anonymous owner who claimed they had #15004.... Other than that type of Nessie sighting,,,Zip.

arthur i know the number you are talking about......i am trying to buy that gun back,and i know who has it right now..............

however i have a choice on that one or another of my old one's back.............too many choice's.................

its in around 95% condition...........however i think i will go the historic route,and get my second choice......

its one of the colts that was in the lock-up when dillinger broke out of mi.city ind.


me bad........i should never let the cat out of the bag.......RONNIE
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#5 Fencer

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Posted 01 March 2004 - 05:46 PM

Colt21a/Ron,

Ya lost me. if you have not seen a #15XXX then how did you own one once? blink.gif

Can't keep the respected member tag if you aren't telling the truth! biggrin.gif
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#6 Walter63a

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Posted 01 March 2004 - 07:10 PM

I believe Ron should be known as our 'respected joker'!!! biggrin.gif laugh.gif laugh.gif
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#7 Z3BigDaddy

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Posted 01 March 2004 - 07:13 PM

Hmmm That is quite perplexing... blink.gif
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#8 TD.

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Posted 01 March 2004 - 08:56 PM

Ron,
Colt Thompson Serial Number 45 is in the Museum of Connecticut History in Hartford, Connecticut. I would guess it is the earliest surviving Thompson. It does not appear to have ever left the factory in that it does not have front or rear sights. It has been reported that the lower frame is not serial numbered. This is not too surprising given the earliest Thompsons were made with lower frames without a provision to attach a butt stock. It is quite possible (i.e., speculation on my part) when NO 45 was retrofitted with a "new" frame with a butt stock attachment, no serial number was applied to the lower frame because it was not going to be released to Auto-Ordnance for sale.

Tracie Hill has the lower frame from Colt Thompson Serial Number 44 on display in his collection. He also has what may be the rear sight from Serial Number 44 but that is not 100% certain (as per Tracie). The receiver of NO 44 was destroyed and the parts imported into the United States.

Arthur,
I have not heard of the 15004 story before now. Roger Cox does state in his book on page 5 that 15036 was verified as sold in the United States. I am pretty sure my conversation with Roger occurred prior to the publication of his book.

This string is still new. Maybe someone will have seen or heard of a 15000 Colt. unsure.gif
Thanks,
Tom

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#9 colt21a

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Posted 01 March 2004 - 10:03 PM

the gun number is 1504 somebody put a 0 on a picture i had on it,and called it 15040.................however i got a chance to see the gun first hand around 1997.....

it was owned by the virginia state police.and i brokered the deal on it years ago............so i am not telling tale's but the other guy was with a phony pic.........that is why i did my research.................

the gun was traded sold long ago to buy number #167.......i am sure all here know the story on that one,

i havea chance to get the one i mentioned back possibly,but i am optioning out for the historical one........so i did see one but didn't do to camera trick's........this was also once owned by curtis earl............

i do my homework on thompson's,when i set my mind to it..............and if i did not know what the heck i was talking about.sure as heck gordon would have nothing to do with me for his book.wink!!! and thats the end of that tune..................i will see if i can get the pic...........its pretty neat..............ron

a respected joker moniker.............you guys are endless with the joke's.............try to trip up the joker.........never happen.............
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#10 colt21a

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Posted 01 March 2004 - 10:09 PM

QUOTE (TD. @ Mar 1 2004, 08:56 PM)
Ron,
Colt Thompson Serial Number 45 is in the Museum of Connecticut History in Hartford, Connecticut. I would guess it is the earliest surviving Thompson. It does not appear to have ever left the factory in that it does not have front or rear sights. It has been reported that the lower frame is not serial numbered. This is not too surprising given the earliest Thompsons were made with lower frames without a provision to attach a butt stock. It is quite possible (i.e., speculation on my part) when NO 45 was retrofitted with a "new" frame with a butt stock attachment, no serial number was applied to the lower frame because it was not going to be released to Auto-Ordnance for sale.

Tracie Hill has the lower frame from Colt Thompson Serial Number 44 on display in his collection. He also has what may be the rear sight from Serial Number 44 but that is not 100% certain (as per Tracie). The receiver of NO 44 was destroyed and the parts imported into the United States.

Arthur,
I have not heard of the 15004 story before now. Roger Cox does state in his book on page 5 that 15036 was verified as sold in the United States. I am pretty sure my conversation with Roger occurred prior to the publication of his book.

This string is still new. Maybe someone will have seen or heard of a 15000 Colt. unsure.gif
Thanks,
Tom

yep tracies frame came thru mike in phx.via mexico.i know all about that deal also...........years ago............wink!!there had been a few early numbers,that was the lowest number..........hey i am only a respected member not a r.k.i.wink!!

Ron
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#11 Walter63a

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Posted 01 March 2004 - 10:13 PM

I knew there had to be a joke, or jest, involved, on someone's part! blink.gif tongue.gif biggrin.gif cool.gif Regards, Walter
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#12 colt21a

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Posted 01 March 2004 - 10:22 PM

QUOTE (Walter63a @ Mar 1 2004, 10:13 PM)
I knew there had to be a joke, or jest, involved, on someone's part! blink.gif tongue.gif biggrin.gif cool.gif Regards, Walter

its no joke just the one on somebody tryin to pass something off that is not.................if anybody offers me a tommy i check it out ten ways to sunday............if it sounds too quirky walther it probably is..wink!!

i have not been taken in 33 years on this stuff.and its too late in the game to start now..........

by the way the gun sold for $8,000.00 over 15 years ago.......

respected joker,RON
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#13 TD.

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Posted 01 March 2004 - 10:41 PM

Ron,
I would like to see the picture of NO 1504 converted to NO 15040 if you can find it. That story is a new one to me. Of course, even if someone could really make serial number 1504 into serial number 15040 with the best (or should I say worst) fraudulent alteration techniques available, I suspect you would be asking a lot of questions about the lack of 1922 patent dates on the other side of the receiver. I imagine the squared off actuator slot and AUT-OR-CO emblem on top would be somewhat suspect too. However, a picture of (a fake) NO 15040 would generate a lot of interest to say the least - even with the proper disclaimers. A post of this picture would be great.
Thanks,
Tom

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#14 Arthur Fliegenheimer

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Posted 01 March 2004 - 10:53 PM

You go TD!!!!
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#15 John Jr

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Posted 01 March 2004 - 11:33 PM

Didnt we just see the other day a Savage (think panda is buying it) with a 15042or 43 number on it? Much more collectable piece I would think. Just my 2 cents worth.

JR
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#16 Arthur Fliegenheimer

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Posted 02 March 2004 - 12:06 AM

John J,
Except that Savage was really 150430. Even a Savage TSMG can be involved in a fraud.

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#17 colt21a

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Posted 02 March 2004 - 12:22 AM

QUOTE (TD. @ Mar 1 2004, 10:41 PM)
Ron,
I would like to see the picture of NO 1504 converted to NO 15040 if you can find it. That story is a new one to me. Of course, even if someone could really make serial number 1504 into serial number 15040 with the best (or should I say worst) fraudulent alteration techniques available, I suspect you would be asking a lot of questions about the lack of 1922 patent dates on the other side of the receiver. I imagine the squared off actuator slot and AUT-OR-CO emblem on top would be somewhat suspect too. However, a picture of (a fake) NO 15040 would generate a lot of interest to say the least - even with the proper disclaimers. A post of this picture would be great.
Thanks,
Tom

this party took a pic of the gun with white letter's and had a white 0 at the end of it so it looked like 15040.......
probably to do it as a joke.....{get it}

and i guess you could not do it with any numbered gun.........{the famous curtis earl white lettering}
i have a pic of the original gun in color 35 mm. i can send it to ron mill's.......and he can post it for me somehow......i am a t-rex on this stuff...........

nobody was trying to peddle anything which it was not.....and at this point i know who has the gun......and its not going anyplace.............its oiled and in its safe........

it has and never was converted to anything.so please don't post that it was...........

this is info that i have................as i said before i have not seen in hand in possession a 15xxx colt

end of story fairly simple.....................and yes square actuator slot, no correct patent dates,auto ord early logo......and you forget automatic semi automatic,not marked safe full auto like a 1922 gun would be marked,

however i did have a 3000 range 28 navy with early frame marks,it now resides in texas..............sold in around 1999....................

take care,ron

now i am the joker huh???
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#18 colt21a

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Posted 02 March 2004 - 12:37 AM

QUOTE (John Jr @ Mar 1 2004, 11:33 PM)
Didnt we just see the other day a Savage (think panda is buying it) with a 15042or 43 number on it? Much more collectable piece I would think. Just my 2 cents worth.

JR

yes it would,since i don't think 15040 exists,because i think it ended up in south america or cuba........my 2cents.......ron
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#19 colt21a

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Posted 02 March 2004 - 12:39 AM

QUOTE (Arthur Fliegenheimer @ Mar 2 2004, 12:06 AM)
John J,
Except that Savage was really 150430. Even a Savage's TSMG can be involved in a fraud.

i am glad you did not say you go girl.you had me worried arthur!!!! ron
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#20 giantpanda4

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Posted 02 March 2004 - 07:52 AM

Yes, I have "15043" coming in a few months. rolleyes.gif
It definnitely is not the original s/n. The other reciever markings are incorrect. As to what the s/n originally was... that is speculation. Hopefully when I get it and the barel comes off, it will yeild a clue - unless there was a good effort to conceal it's real ID.
My question with1504 switched to 15040... WHY? What s/n would be worth more to a collector??? As mentioned, the squared off actuator slot would be a dead givaway.
I guess I will remain curious as to why people buy things just for collecting - and not shooting -but thats just me.
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