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27a1 Still Not Quite Running Right.


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#1 TN.Frank

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Posted 29 September 2004 - 11:52 AM

Dang thing still isn't quite running right. I polished the underside of the bolt nose after recessing it about 1mm. I left the first 1/2" of the bolt nose alone because the underside of this part is what strips the ctg. from the mag so it's intact, but the rest from there back is recessed and polished up real nice so it shouldn't interfear with the ctgs. in the mag enough to stop the bolt from going into battery. I put a 1/8" piece of leather behind the recoil guide to add back the pressure that removing a coil and a half might have taken away so spring tention should be fine.
Something else is creating a friction point, some other rough spot that I just can't seem to find. I'm really getting tired of dickin' with this gun. I don't have the money to start replacing parts, heck, I've already got $1100 into it with all the little parts that I've bought to set it up the way that I wanted it. I've put a horizontal forearm w/sling swivel, modified mag catch(so I can use un-modified FA mags.) paddle safety, round 28a1 style cocking knob and M1 rear sight on the gun, plus I picked up 5 new 30 round mags from Northridge, which set me back to the tune of $30 bucks a mag plus shipping but they're really nice, NEW mags.
The bolt should be fine now so I'm not going to replace it, that and I don't have the $120 that Khar Arms wants for a new one. There's just some other rough place that stopping the bolt from going all the way into battery and it's driving me nuts. I'd sell the darn thing if I could get $975 from someone. I'd be taking a loss but I could always roll the money over into a semi-auto UZI in 45acp for about $650 and that'd leave me enough to get mags and other stuff. Oh well, talk to me people. What should I do, does anyone want to take this gun off of my hands, should I just dig a hole in the back yard and burry it, LOL. unsure.gif
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#2 LIONHART

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Posted 29 September 2004 - 11:55 AM

Frank, has this Gun always had problems, or did they just happen to start one day??
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#3 SecondAmend

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Posted 29 September 2004 - 11:59 AM

Did the 27A1 work okay with the origianl mag catch and modified mag(s)? Though it shouldn't, the new mag catch/mag combination may be feeding the cartridges improperly.
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#4 TN.Frank

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Posted 29 September 2004 - 12:02 PM

user posted image
I never really shot it enough to tell if it had problem or not. It seemed to work fine until I installed the round 28 style cocking knob but I really don't think that's it. I've polished up the part of the cocking knob so it doesn't bind where it fits into the bolt, same as the stock one. It's almost like it needs stiffer springs or something.
Here's a pic of the gun. It's a nice looking gun and I've got all the stock parts that go with it including the modified 30 round mag and mag catch. If you want to play with it and fix it send me $975 and I'll take it to my dealer and have him ship it to your dealer when my dealer get's a copy of your dealers FFL.
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#5 LIONHART

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Posted 29 September 2004 - 12:09 PM

QUOTE (SecondAmend @ Sep 29 2004, 11:59 AM)
Did the 27A1 work okay with the origianl mag catch and modified mag(s)? Though it shouldn't, the new mag catch/mag combination may be feeding the cartridges improperly.

That's what I've been thinking too...
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#6 TN.Frank

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Posted 29 September 2004 - 12:17 PM

If I remember right it did work fine after I installed the modified mag catch. I really don't think that's it because when the gun is in cocked even with the mag out you can feel a rough spot as the bolt slides forward. There's some little spot that's got a burr or is a little rough that's putting enough friction on the bolt to take away enough of it's momentum to stop it from going into battery.
99 times out of 100 I can fix a gun and get it working, I've always had kind of a knack for it but this is really starting to get on my last nerve. I've polished up everything that I can think of, I've added a little extra tollerence to places where there was too much friction, I've done all that I can think of(short of cough up some money and send it off to PK) and I'm still not getting results. Like I said, IF John Browning had built it, it'd work fine out of the box. He was a god in the field of firearms design. cool.gif

Edited by TN.Frank, 29 September 2004 - 12:18 PM.

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#7 TN.Frank

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Posted 29 September 2004 - 12:34 PM

Just for grins I replaced the 28 style cocking knob with the stock one, if anything there is more friction even with the mag out, when the gun is cocked. sad.gif
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#8 TN.Frank

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Posted 29 September 2004 - 12:53 PM

user posted image
I built up this "no ban" AR with a Model 1 Parts kit on Sept. 13th. It's in .300 Fireball and ran perfectly right out of the box. Go figure. blink.gif

Edited by TN.Frank, 29 September 2004 - 12:53 PM.

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#9 TN.Frank

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Posted 29 September 2004 - 05:50 PM

Well, any takers. $975 gets you a 27a1 set up real nice with all the original parts and all it needs is a little work or maybe it'll even ware in with some shooting. Talk to me people. smile.gif
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#10 Grey Crow

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Posted 29 September 2004 - 06:37 PM

TN.FRANK,

If that's a Westy AO 27A1, you would be best to go to Numrich Arms for the bolt, as the Kahr probably won't work without a few modifcations on a milling machine.

Or put it away, save to send it out to PK, or Damion in NY....
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#11 TN.Frank

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Posted 29 September 2004 - 07:11 PM

I noticed that Khar Arms had two different bolts, one with a "long" firing pin and the other with the "short" firing pin, I've got the short firing pin. I'd be willing to bet that it's something minor but I'm sick of messing with it. I'd just like to sell it to someone that wouldn't mind fixing it then I'd use the money to pick up an UZI in 45ACP and put a barrel shroud on it and get a few mags for it. That way I'd still have a 45ACP carbine.
I don't have the money to spend on it right now. After my AR build($1600 bucks total) the wife read me the riot act and told me "no more guns this year" that also means anything other then ammo so I'm pretty much stuck with a gun that doesn't work the way that I'd like it to and the sad part is all the money that I've got tied up in it.
Someone has to be interested in it for $975, especially since I've got $425 in parts and mags that go with it. unsure.gif
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#12 brian

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Posted 29 September 2004 - 08:49 PM

can you shoot it at all?
if so just run it like that for a while, sooner later it will wear in.

you ever measure the springs to see if you have a bad set? maybe they're too short.

this seems to be a first for the 27's, or atleast i don't recall anybody else posting a simular problem.
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#13 TN.Frank

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Posted 29 September 2004 - 09:04 PM

QUOTE (brian @ Sep 29 2004, 08:49 PM)
can you shoot it at all?
if so just run it like that for a while, sooner later it will wear in.

you ever measure the springs to see if you have a bad set? maybe they're too short.

this seems to be a first for the 27's, or atleast i don't recall anybody else posting a simular problem.

When the problem first started I thougt it was because the bolt wasn't coming back enough to re-cock the action so I cut off a coil and a half from the recoil springs and one coil from the firing pin spring. I do have a piece of leather (about an 1/8" thick) between the upper and the recoil spring guide to move it forward a bit, that should make the recoil springs more then stiff enough. As long as I push the bolt forward(generally just a mm or so, not much) it'll shoot. It may need new springs or just need to be shot a bit but either way I'm tired of messing with it. I'd rather just take a loss and sell it and pick up something else.
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#14 Zamm

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Posted 29 September 2004 - 09:16 PM

Frank,
you have mail.
Zamm
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#15 TN.Frank

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Posted 29 September 2004 - 09:29 PM

QUOTE (Zamm @ Sep 29 2004, 09:16 PM)
Frank,
you have mail.
Zamm

Thanks, I'll give em' a try.
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