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Atf Thompson Transfer - What Can I Do?!?


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#1 DC Chris

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Posted 04 November 2004 - 08:06 PM

All-

I'm at my wits end with the ATF.

I have a Thompson out on transfer since the first week of May this year. No big deal. I wait 90 calendar days. Nothing. Well, maybe is 90 business days - nothing. So I decide to call after about 4 calendar months and I'm told I'm still pending.

I wait a month a politely call back on the 5th of October. Still pending. I ask to speak to my examiner, Tammy. She is actually very nice and checks my paperwork and finds that "my fingerprint cards were not sent to the FBI to check." Okay, so she sends them off, promises to call me back in a few days, implying it wouldn't take long. I call her in a week, leave a polite message and don't get a call back. I wait four more weeks (this week) and, you guessed it, still pending. I call her supervisor Dawn, get her voice mail, politely ask her to call me and that was two days ago.

I really think I have been pateint with them and the last thing I want to do is be a PITA by calling them every week. I have concerns because I would probably still be sitting there without them sending my cards to the FBI if I didn't inquire about it on 10/05. That is the ATF's job - NOT MINE!!! I get promised that the cards would come back within a few days I would get a call back and nothing for a month (and counting). I cannot get an employee or her supervisor to ever call me back. All I want to know is what is going on and what I can do to help (if anything - resubmit cards, etc). I have other NFA items and never had such poor service in a transfer before. I submitted all of my paperwork correctly (to my knowledge) and was never asked to submit any thing since.

So, I guess I'm back to square one.... another 3 months? 6 months? I don't even know anymore.

Anyone have any advice (besides chill out) or stories? I have heard other horror stories of transfer times and always considered myself lucky ... until now. If the ATF was a business, they would have lost me as a customer for pretty much lacking any customer service when I need it.

Sorry for the rant. I want my Thompson!!!

mad.gif

Chris

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#2 Brickyard

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Posted 04 November 2004 - 08:37 PM

Well, it's a minor story but an idea too. Fax 'em. Both Tammy and Dawn are very nice and have been very helpful to me in just the last few days. I've had some of my best luck if it's a sheet of paper with data on it that they can review/give to someone to check on, etc.

It's a try? Obviously put the serial number on it, tell Tammy you'd spoken to her and would like an update, bla, bla, bla.

Be nice. I know it's VERY hard but more flies with honey .....

My $ .02

Good luck.


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#3 philasteen

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Posted 04 November 2004 - 08:43 PM

Tammy was pretty helpful to me in unsticking one of my transfers. I always found her professional and nice, and she did go a good job of getting the problem fixed (needed to show gun was owned by transferor but the transferor had lost him Form 4!).
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#4 Sgt

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Posted 04 November 2004 - 09:14 PM

My gun was also held up for some minor reasons, but with a major time wait. If you are buying from a dealer, I am convinced that they get better responses. Maybe they can call for you. My dealer found out the problem and fixed it. After eight months of waiting, the transfer came through within the month.
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#5 The1930sRust

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Posted 04 November 2004 - 09:45 PM

Am I dreaming or have people actually contacted the office of their respective state representatives to help with ATF issues?
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#6 2dogsfightin

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Posted 04 November 2004 - 10:46 PM

I FEEL YOUR PAIN>>>> paid the dealer on april 4 .......picked up my M1A1 on Oct 19 . Thats 6 and a half months. and this was my first class 3. I just about went nuckung futs......... First the finger print card did not have my d.o.b. ....do over.......sent back.......next my citizenship form was wrong.....my fault but I did not know.....do over .....send back....pending....pending.....pending...... Finally in an act of despiration I talked to the Sherriff who had signed my request for NFA GUN (he is also a personal friend) He gave me the name and phone # of our local ATF agent......OK..Set down.....put your coffee down and pay attention. I called this guy......Are you setting?? ......He was very nice. I told him I hated to bother him but I had been waiting six months. I told him I had tried to contact my examiner but always got a recording. He took all the info and said , Ill get back to you. YEAH RIGHT, I thought. Still sitting....Within one hour he called me back and said your approved!!!! I about fell out of my chair. The next day i called ATF and the girl said APPROVED!!. This agent did me a lot of good it may be worth a try for you. Just be polite and tell the man how long you have been patiently waiting.

My 02 , 2Dogs.....OUT
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#7 First Sergeant

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Posted 05 November 2004 - 08:09 AM

Since I've "only" been waiting 13 weeks for one and 10 weeks on another I feel like a youngster on this thread. However, I have a differant twist to my delay. Last week I found out that a set of my print cards were returned to my dept by the FBI. Reason given? "We don't do print cards for the ATF." Keep in mind these were sent to the FBI by the ATF. To the best of my knowledge they are the only game in town and have been checking prints for NFA transfers since 1934.

Since I have no way of knowing which transfer the prints were from, both examiners have been contacted. So far, no explanation. I'm a very patient man for a valid reason but to say they don't do the prints for ATF is a bit thin.

Still waiting.........

Chuck
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#8 gijive

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Posted 05 November 2004 - 09:09 AM

First Sergeant.

Some clerk obviously gave someone the wrong information. Maybe a new employee at the FBI, maybe a new employee at the NFA Branch, who knows? Someone has the incorrect information. The fingerprint cards are checked by the FBI and this is generally where the longest part of the delay in the process occurs.

If the fingerprint cards were returned for a clerical error of some sort this could further delay the process. Remember, the NFA Branch is small and not a huge priority in the overall scheme of BATF. Patience and a polite attitude when making inquiries goes a long way in allowing the process to be completed successfully.
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#9 Bob

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Posted 05 November 2004 - 10:00 AM

I had a problem with a personal transfer about five years ago. Contacted my reps (won’t name names but we in Washington know who was of no help) and the transfer mysteriously occurred. It was the same run-around and phone tag until the director called me to advise everything was good to go. Have not had any problems since.
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#10 First Sergeant

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Posted 05 November 2004 - 11:05 AM

GI Give,

I'm sure it was a newbie with the Bureau. Our Prints Officer spoke with 3 differant people with the FBI trying to straighten it out but each one he spoke had the same answer. One did mention the REASON for the prints was wrong. I've always used "NFA Transfer" in that box, not sure why that would be wrong this time.

Politeness goes a long way with nearly everyone in Gov't at all levels; city, county, state and federal.

Chuck
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#11 gijive

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Posted 05 November 2004 - 01:03 PM

Chuck,

Something just occurred to me while rereading your post. You stated the FBI returned the cards to your department? Are you a member of a law enforcement agency? If so, did your department use their own blue FBI applicant cards with their unique ORI? If this is the case, that may be the problem. The ATF should have their own applicant type cards that they provide so the fingerprint search results are returned to them, not the the person or agency that submitted the cards.

Just trying to figure out what went wrong here, aside from an uninformed employee at the FBI end.
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#12 First Sergeant

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Posted 05 November 2004 - 10:11 PM

GI GIVE

Yes, you are correct on all accounts and our cards do have our ORI on them but they are standard FBI applicant cards. Never been a problem before however. The cards clearly state my employer, which matches the ORI. I'll check if they now require seperate cards. I would like to get this cleared up before I submit paperwork on an M1A1 I just bought.

Thanks !

Chuck
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#13 21 smoker

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Posted 06 November 2004 - 06:23 AM

One common theme on the rejection here seems to be the finger print cards...or in some other posts...the cleo signoff....something I have avoided all these years by going corporate...very simple to maintain and much easier transfers..no photos,no fingerprints, no cleo signoffs...just your toys in 30-60 days...something to think about... wink.gif
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#14 DC Chris

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Posted 06 November 2004 - 01:14 PM

All-

Thanks for the interesting responses and advice. Its reassuring to me that others have or are in the same boat I'm in and there might be light at the end of the tunnel. I guess I'm just getting a little down on the whole process and losing faith.

I decided to take a combination of advice given here and 1) contact my dealer and 2) have him fax in the information (my cancelled check, etc) to someone he deals with in the ATF.

When I talked to my dealer, he seemed pretty upset at the service he was getting too. He said he had a form 3 transfer that was going on 5 months and the other guy wanted his money on the 50/50 transfer. He also said he had a few other form 4's that were going on longer than expected and he was going work on it Tuesday with the ATF.

With all of the technology available, you would think somehow that the ATF could cut down on all these phone calls and inquiries if they could set up a secure web site so dealers and people like us could log in and see what is going on with transfers. I know its a pipe dream, but I guess they assume paying an employee to answer the phone and do it manually is better. wink.gif

I guess I'm dissatisfied for four reasons:
1) No activity with my cards happened until I raised the issue ... amost 5 months later. The cards should go out right away and no one there caught the fact that nothing was happening.
2) Not getting any type of call backs on messages ... why the hell even have voicemail?
3) Maybe getting to talk to your examiner live on the telephone 5% of the time.
4) Being promised to "get a call back in a few days". Don't say it if you aren't going to do it!

I know it is what it is and we are still lucky to have the right to own NFA items, but geesh.... the bottom line is there is not a damn thing we can do as tax payers and NFA collectors who pay the salaries to support this no-account system.

Chris

Edited by DC Chris, 06 November 2004 - 01:24 PM.

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#15 First Sergeant

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Posted 09 November 2004 - 10:31 PM

Just an update.

Received notification that one of the pending transfers (Reising M50)is approved and I should have it by Thursday. Who knows about the 1928A1 (AC) that is pending. Identical print cards were submitted on both guns so that shouldn't be an issue. Maybe since both examiners spoke with eachother about the errant print card(s) the second transfer won't be delayed. I can only hope.

DC,

It was 14 weeks with the screw up; so hang in there !!

Chuck
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#16 DC Chris

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Posted 09 November 2004 - 11:10 PM

Thanks Chuck.

I am honestly happy to hear that there is some activity on one of your guns.

I'm on 26 weeks and counting. .. 6 calendar months and counting. My only saving grace is my dealer is has an indoor class three range. I can at least shoot it, but cannot take it home. I want to give it a good cleaning and oiling.

Hopefully I will have some good news before Christmas, but here is to hoping.

Chris.

Edited by DC Chris, 09 November 2004 - 11:11 PM.

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#17 Arthur Fliegenheimer

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Posted 09 November 2004 - 11:45 PM

No doubt all the people who submitted Stewart Forms have helped to clutter up the ATF system only to eventually get their forms back stamped with the ineluctable "DISAPPROVED."
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#18 John Jr

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Posted 09 November 2004 - 11:54 PM

QUOTE (Arthur Fliegenheimer @ Nov 9 2004, 10:45 PM)
No doubt all the people who submitted Stewart Forms have helped to clutter up the ATF system only to eventually get their forms back stamped with the ineluctable "DISAPPROVED."

SBR's dont help speed up the process either.


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#19 Jay Baker

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Posted 10 November 2004 - 06:42 AM

Hearing and reading of some of the horror stories on transfer times makes me realize how fortunate I've been on all of mine. The worst time I had was about 120 days on an M16 and suppressor. While the clerk was fingerprinting me she was on her cell phone talking to her shrink complaining about her job-I s**t you not. I was trying to ignore the conversation and therefore stopped paying attention to everything else while she printed my left fingers in the Right Hand boxes on one of the cards. Instead of a new card, she just noted the error on the card. No doubt it resulted in an extra 30 days. And she wasn't there the last I went for prints.
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#20 Arthur Fliegenheimer

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Posted 10 November 2004 - 10:31 AM

QUOTE
Why do you not want ALL NFA lover's to have the chance to own an MG? Are you afraid that your "investment" might depreciate?


I couldn't care less if $5,000 sears were rightfully selling for $5. But no one who has submitted a Stewart app in, or out of, the 9th District has had "APPROVAL" stamped on their form. All these people have accomplished is to flood ATF with paperwork that had no chance of flying, while forcing other legitimate forms to languish in the pile. Sending in Stewart forms before there is a final decision on the ruling is folly. These people seem to be counting on a slip up by an ATF employee to send a from back inadvertently stamped "APPROVED."

For someone who is constantly memento mori to anyone who deals, buys, or sells in imported former American made NFA parts, you seem to be singing a different tune when it comes to someone sneaking a form past ATF.

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