Thompson Ammo In Ww2
Posted 02 February 2005 - 12:42 PM
Posted 02 February 2005 - 02:43 PM
Ball .45 ammo came in 600 round "Spam" cans containing 12 pasteboard boxes of 50 rounds, or resealable steel boxes (the same sized cans as .50 ammo) containing 20 boxes each for a total of 1000 rounds. Two cans made up a wire bound wooden case. These cans were then broken down from the wooden shipping cases from the ammunition pallats provided by the arsenal or contractor. They were then carried forward by trucks or jeeps, and finally by supply details or even mules (in Italy), generally by night if enemy observation was likely.
Wire bound wooden cases were the norm during WWII for almost all American- produced supplies. The wire cutters issued to most troops saw a great deal more action opening cases of ammunition and rations than they ever did on enemy barbed wire!
Expended magazines were refilled by the individual soldier from boxes taken from the cans. Most troops would carry extra 50 round boxes in their pockets or musette bags for topping off as necessary. There were no loaders; single rounds were pressed into the magazines one by one, just as we do it today. Magazines were not thrown away unless damaged but many were dropped and lost during combat.
The .45 ammunition expended by the British and other allies was all made in the USA and was provided under Lend-Lease or direct military assistance. By the way, some 5.1 billion rounds of .45 ball ammo were produced during WWII. If one round were fired per second, it would take 1,616 years (give or take) to fire up that much .45 ammo!
Posted 02 February 2005 - 05:53 PM
Posted 05 February 2005 - 12:40 PM
I recently bough this ammo tin http://cgi.ebay.com/...item=2293902910 would this have been the type used for Thompson ammo? or is pistol ammo in some way different?
Posted 06 February 2005 - 11:23 AM
Posted 06 February 2005 - 12:12 PM
Posted 07 February 2005 - 11:23 AM
Speaking with T-5 Tony Tamburino an WWII 82nd Airborne Military Police Plt. motorcycle rider, he stated he was only ever issued two magazines for the Thompson he carried on his 1942 Harley. He told me they just taped the two together. I assumed they were 30 rd mags; he did not remember.
Posted 07 February 2005 - 02:34 PM
In many years of collecting and research, I've never come across references to .45 ball TSMG ammo being issued in factory sealed cans containing loaded magazines, and have never seen a .45 can marked, "in magazines". All cans have been marked, "in cartons". Every cardboard box of .45 I've ever seen was marked "pistol, ball" (or with the subtype), meaning that it was for use with the M1917, M1911 or M1911A1 pistols. This is all that was issued for TSMGs; there was no seperate supply of TSMG ammo.
Ecky's photo is of a typical Russian can, full of repacked WWII era .45. This was not the type of can that the ammo was originally packed in. I've shot a great deal of this Russian re-pack, and have found only commercially produced lend-lease ammunition in it from Winchester, Western Cartridge Company, and Remington. It has contained no arsenal made ammuniton that I've seen. This has been great ammunition, by the way.
Posted 07 February 2005 - 03:10 PM
A good spring - properly designed - will not be damaged by deflection within its design parameters.
(Actually, you could make the case that loading and unloading is more potentially damaging, since each time you do that you get a cycle of alternating stress which could lead to fatigue failure - a different failure mode. However, to head off another urban legend, you would probably wear out your fingers before you could put enough stress cycles on it to cause a Thompson (or other) magazine spring to break.)
(For completeness, there is a very high-temperature phenomenon called "creep", which as its name implies, is a change in deflection at constant stress. That would not apply here.)
Posted 07 February 2005 - 03:41 PM
Posted 08 February 2005 - 07:21 AM
You are right about fatigue... you may need probably tens of million cycles to fail a spring.
Creep is not only a high temp thing - just more noticable at high temp. Hang a weight on a piece of solder - it will show creep..
Slip is what you forgot, a reduction of stress under constant deflection. Similar to creep. Over time the springs could experience slip and not return to their original length. FWIW.