
Wwii L Drums
#1
Posted 04 May 2005 - 02:23 PM
#2
Posted 05 May 2005 - 09:32 AM
#3
Posted 05 May 2005 - 09:46 AM
MIS208 and a Seymour not on the web site are headed for my house soon.


Roger
#4
Posted 05 May 2005 - 04:46 PM
#5
Posted 06 May 2005 - 11:54 AM
That's a switch. I am usually the one who just missed a buy. A Bridgeport 1st variation comes to mind. I missed that one by five minutes a couple years back and haven't seen one since.
Did you pick up any of the other drums that they have/had?
Motocar,
Thanks for the heads up!! The opportunity was much appreciated.
Roger
#6
Posted 08 May 2005 - 03:40 PM

#7
Posted 08 May 2005 - 04:31 PM
#8
Posted 08 May 2005 - 07:53 PM
#9
Posted 09 May 2005 - 09:04 AM
The proprietors are obviously a little out of their league concerning Thompson drums. No, they have not been willing to say where they are getting these from (no big surprise there...).
Since they got so much interest in their first posting, I am guessing the prices are going to stay high until the drums don't sell.
Roger
#10
Posted 14 May 2005 - 06:46 PM

MIke Hammer
#11
Posted 14 May 2005 - 07:15 PM
QUOTE (Mike Hammer @ May 14 2005, 06:46 PM) |
These are examples of the later manufactured Bridgeport drums as opposed to the earlier Bridgeport drums where the side plate lists the 1921 and 1928 winds separately. How do you interpret this drum as having a Seymour cover??? ![]() |
Mike Hammer,
The drums currently pictured on the Collectors Firearms website have Seymour covers ( see page 167 of American Thunder). If you purchased one from them and it has a proper Auto-Ordnance, Bridgeport, Ct cover, then they are using the same photograph of a mismatched drum to describe a Bridgeport varity.
By the way, the Bridgeport, Ct marked drums did not have any winding instructions marked for 1921 Models. All Bridgeport drums say "Wind to 9 or 11 Clicks." The last model that mentions specific winding instructions for a 1921 Model are the Worcester Presssed Steel marked drums that have a New York, N.Y. address.
#12
Posted 14 May 2005 - 09:05 PM

Mike Hammer
#13
Posted 15 May 2005 - 01:30 AM
#14
Posted 15 May 2005 - 06:43 AM
Does your "earlier" drum with the 1921 winding instructions have any other markings on the cover under the winding key hole? Such as any "Wind to 9 Clicks" instructions without a Thompson bullet logo? If so, and the body has the Auto-Ordnance Bridgeport, Ct address on the rear, the drum is probably a Bridgeport body and a Worcester Pressed Steel cover. Also, does the cover have the drain slots on the face plate?
#15
Posted 16 May 2005 - 01:33 PM
Actually, the reason you have a matched drum is because I told Collector's Firearms to switch the cover between two of their drums. They had one that was not shown on the web site that had a Bridgeport cover and Seymour body. MS-210 as shown on the web site had a Seymour cover and Bridgeport body. If your cover has the WIND TO 9 OR 11 CLICKS and the Bullet Logo, it is probably a fourth variation Bridgeport (I think that was the only Bridgeport cover that they had). If so the letters should be 0.180 inches high.
The pictures shown of MS-210 had the block U instead of the outlined U, which makes the body a third or fifth variation. That is a slight mismatch, but still Bridgeport. Most people won't care which variation they have, especially if it runs well.
I am using as my reference the recent article in TCN on Bridgeport drums.
gijive,
Actually, according to the TCN article, the first two variations of the Bridgeport drum had the 1921 winding instructions on the cover face plate. The first variation also had the New York, N.Y., U.S.A. address on the body face plate. That is the so-called transitional Bridgeport drum.
Roger
#16
Posted 16 May 2005 - 02:15 PM
QUOTE (TSMG28 @ May 16 2005, 01:33 PM) |
Actually, according to the TCN article, the first two variations of the Bridgeport drum had the 1921 winding instructions on the cover face plate. The first variation also had the New York, N.Y., U.S.A. address on the body face plate. That is the so-called transitional Bridgeport drum. Roger |
Roger,
Thanks for the correction. Weren't the early variations still made by Worcester Pressed Steel with the 1921 winding instructions if they still had the New York address on them? Did the earliest versions with the New York address have the U stamped on them? I guess I didn't read the article closely enough.
#17
Posted 16 May 2005 - 02:47 PM
The first variation was made by United Specialties, has the U on the cover and body face plates and the New York address including the comma after the N.Y. like the Colt drums had. I don't recall whether the font and spacing was the same as the Colt drums. Both of the first two variations have the WIND TO 9 CLICKS in an arc under the winding key and both the 1921 and 1928 winding instructions on the cover face plate like the Worcester drums. Starting with the third variation, the arc stamping changed to WIND TO 9 OR 11 CLICKS as did the cover front plate.
Interestingly, all of the cover face plates have the oulined U, while all of the body face plates except the fourth variation have the block U. Not to stir the waters, but might this imply that the two halves were made in different plants????
Mike Hammer,
Just to complete the saga, they still have three "Bridgeport" drums up on their web site. All three have Seymour covers and Bridgeport bodies. I expect they will work fine, especially with Bridgeport innards, but those drums are mismatched and they are asking top dollar for them. I would not be surprised to see the price moderate some when they don't sell. The original Seymour and beat-up Crosby are still on the site as well.
Roger
#18
Posted 16 May 2005 - 03:44 PM
QUOTE |
The first variation was made by United Specialties, has the U on the cover and body face plates and the New York address including the comma after the N.Y. like the Colt drums had. |
Oh my God!!! More drum confusion. It is the missing comma after "New York" on the Colt drums that is the distinction between those and the Savage and Bridgeport drums, and not the additional comma after "N.Y.," that appears on all three, but not on the Worcester drums.
Since both the Savage and Bridgeport drums were actually made by the United Specialties Company in Chicago, Illinois and both have "U" stamped on front and back covers, but according to the TCN article, now some New York addressed drums, I guess formerly identified as Savage drums, are being credited as "transitional" Bridgeport, Connecticut drums, even though the drum is neither manufactured in New York or Connecticut? Is the "U.S.CO." stamped on the hub of all these TCN article "five" Bridgeport variations?
Didn't Tracie Hill in his book attempt to create a new pattern of drum by identifying the third no "NO" stamped Colt drum as a Worcester" drum?
#19
Posted 16 May 2005 - 04:38 PM
As far as the "older" Bridgeport drum I mentioned, the body plate has the Bridgeport address with the "block" U. The cover plate has the 21 and 28 winding instructions and stamped in an arc under the winding key on the cover body is "wind to 9 clicks", I take this to be one of the "early" Bridgeport drums.
I don't have a copy of the new TCN article on the drums, but it sounds like an interesting article. I'm curious to know if Doug Richardson's pamphlet on Thompson drums is worth picking up a copy?
Mike Hammer
#20
Posted 17 May 2005 - 12:26 PM
Yes, Doug's Drum Magazine book is worth having. Unless he has updated it recently (my copy is a couple years old), it is a little dated, but it contains excellent detail on most of the drum variations (prior to West Hurley/Kahr). He did publish an article in TCN after he had the books made that commented about finding a new Bridgeport variation that was not in his book. The recent article in TCN showed the five Bridgeport variations that have been identified (so far). All were made by United Specialties.
Your "older" Bridgeport drum is either first or second variation. If it has the New York address, it is first. If it has the Bridgeport address, it is second.
If you don't have copies of TCN does that mean that you are not a member of the Thompson Collector's Association? If not, I encourage you to join. See TCA Web Site. The newsletter comes out once a quarter and the last two have had updated information on drum magazines. Several issues in 2001 had an excellent breakdown on all of the known box magazines. You can find the 2001 articles online at The Unofficial Tommy Gun Page. Right now, that site only contains issues between 1997 and 2003. Back issues can be acquired from Tracie Hill for a nominal fee. As a member of TCA, you can also attend one of the annual Show & Shoots that TCA holds (see other threads).
Enjoy the drums - both owning and using!
Roger