Jump to content


Photo
- - - - -

Ammo Pouch Question


  • Please log in to reply
11 replies to this topic

#1 p51

p51

    Member

  • Regular Group
  • 70 posts

Posted 19 May 2005 - 11:47 PM

I just scored a mint condition 5-cell 20-round mag pouch off of evilbay, and I'm very pleased with it, but I'm also confused. I have "American Thunder II" where it's discussed and ID'd as a probable USMC purchased pouch direct from the civilian mfg.
This thing is utterly devoid of any markings whatsoever. It's not a repro, I know that much.
To me from what I know of procurement during WW2 doesn't sound right. After almost 20 years of handling WW2 US stuff, I've probably only seen one or two completely unmarked anything in canvas.
Does anyone else have a pouch like this?
  • 0

#2 brian

brian

    Regular Member

  • Regular Group
  • 345 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:lebanon,Pa

Posted 20 May 2005 - 07:25 AM

ima is selling some. picked mine up almost two yrs ago 75 bucks. no markings, not one.
  • 0

#3 Johan Willaert

Johan Willaert

    New Member

  • Regular Group
  • 17 posts
  • Location:Belgium
  • Interests:US Army in the ETO 1941-1945

Posted 20 May 2005 - 08:10 AM

I've had one since 1985....
Another only has the US on the front middle flap....
NO markings on the inside of the belt loop either...

I'm pretty convinced they are OK...

Johan
  • 0

#4 TSMG28

TSMG28

    Respected Member

  • Board Benefactor
  • 415 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Ohio

Posted 20 May 2005 - 09:54 AM

I also have an unmarked 5-cell pouch that is WWII vintage. It is often referred to as the 'commercial" versions, though I don't know of any documentation that these were ever sold to the public.

The unmarked pouches are believed to have been made specifically for the Marines by a firm that I think was located in Pittsburgh. I will look into my records to see if I can find the name, but I think Frank included it in American Thunder I. The story goes that the Marines did not want to wait for the slow supply channels and contracted directly with this firm. It is not known whether the absence of any markings was intentional or (more likely) didn't matter to the Marines that wanted them.

Another one of those Thompson mysteries which we will probably never solve for sure.....
  • 0

#5 TSMGguy

TSMGguy

    Long Time RKI Member

  • Board Benefactor
  • 2120 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:West of the Pecos, Texas
  • Interests:Motorcycles, old airplanes, and guns.

Posted 20 May 2005 - 10:04 AM

Can you post a photo?
  • 0

#6 p51

p51

    Member

  • Regular Group
  • 70 posts

Posted 20 May 2005 - 10:35 AM

QUOTE
Can you post a photo?

I tried for half an hour, but my photobucket isn't uploading anything for some reason.
Here's one just like it, from the same guy I got mine from:
http://cgi.ebay.com/...ssPageName=WDVW
The guy I got it from wrote back to me, and says he has a lot more where this came from:
rzimkas@comcast.net
I was very pleased with the one I got. There's a small patch (less than 1/4 the size of a dime) of oxidation on one of the lift-a-dot snap heads and it's got that "old canvas" funk, but otherwise it's NOS. You could tell no mags had ever been placed inside it.
He asks for $55 each on ebay for "buy it now," so I'd guess that he'd sell them outright for that much.
Tell him Lee sent ya, really! tongue.gif
Keep in mind, he's not a buddy of mine, I'm not advertising his stuff for him, just like to share a good deal when I find one!
Oh, he also said he has some NOS .45 M1911 holsters going up for ebay soon...
  • 0

#7 TSMGguy

TSMGguy

    Long Time RKI Member

  • Board Benefactor
  • 2120 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:West of the Pecos, Texas
  • Interests:Motorcycles, old airplanes, and guns.

Posted 20 May 2005 - 08:43 PM

The photo came across just fine.

I have one identical to it in my own collection. It came with my M1928A1, which I purchased in 1992. It is absolutely identical with the one pictured except that ".45 TSMG" has been neatly stenciled in black on the front of the pouches. Since the seller had the gun and the pouches for fifty years, I don't doubt the originality at all, even though the color is just slightly more green than the OD #3 or #7 that we are all most familiar with.

Have you looked for markings on the inside of the belt slot?

Uninformed opinion around here has it that the pouch might have been made immediately post war for US military assistance programs, but no proof one way or the other. I do notice however that the 'lift-the-dot' fasteners, weave and weight of the canvas, and weight of the thread used in assembly are absolutely identical to WWII-produced items.

I'm thinking WWII. Nice buy!

  • 0

#8 p51

p51

    Member

  • Regular Group
  • 70 posts

Posted 20 May 2005 - 11:05 PM

QUOTE (TSMGguy @ May 20 2005, 08:43 PM)
I don't doubt the originality at all, even though the color is just slightly more green than the OD #3 or #7 that we are all most familiar with.

Have you looked for markings on the inside of the belt slot?

Well, keep in mind that a lot of canvas we think of as WW2 is heavily faded. A lot of original WW2 items I have that have been unissued and kept indoors are often more greenish than tan.
And as for markings, I looked everywhere, and there's nothing. huh.gif
I've been handling this stuff for years and have never found any web pouch for ammo without even a maker's name or year on it from WW2....
  • 0

#9 TSMG28

TSMG28

    Respected Member

  • Board Benefactor
  • 415 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Ohio

Posted 23 May 2005 - 12:02 PM

The unmarked pouches are discussed in American Thunder I and II (same text). See pages 354-356 of AT II. The so-called commercial pouches are believed to have been produced directly for the Marines by Acme Protection Company of Pittsburgh. As Frank explains and I noted above, it was apparently not uncommon for the Marines to go outside of normal supply channels to acquire critical gear.

Roger
  • 0

#10 2dogsfightin

2dogsfightin

    Long Time Member

  • Regular Group
  • 72 posts

Posted 27 May 2005 - 03:54 PM

Could this be the Russian stuff coming back in??? I have one that I bought for Origional It is also unmarked. It is in as new shape but has "dents" in the canvas. looks like from the "lift the dot" fastener where another ond laid on top of it for many years of storage??


2dogs...........OUT
  • 0

#11 john

john

    Long Time RKI Member

  • Regular Group
  • 551 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Saint Paul, Minnesota

Posted 27 May 2005 - 06:27 PM

I have one also. Pretty nice shape but no marks at all. Bought it from a gun dealer at a local show a couple years back....he had it on the table for $30.00 and I didn't argue too much! wink.gif

john
  • 0

#12 p51

p51

    Member

  • Regular Group
  • 70 posts

Posted 27 May 2005 - 11:56 PM

QUOTE (john @ May 27 2005, 06:27 PM)
I have one also. Pretty nice shape but no marks at all. Bought it from a gun dealer at a local show a couple years back....he had it on the table for $30.00 and I didn't argue too much! wink.gif

Smart, especially when you consider they're going for as much as over $100 on ebay right now. I can't understand why this particular seller isn't getting that much for his, as they're certainly NOS original. But I'm not complaining!
If this eller was smart, they'd market them via ebay as USMC, that would double the price right away. But still, I swear by this person, really nice, quick shipping and good commo.
And no, I'm not making an ad for them!
  • 0