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Need Help On 27a1 Disassembly


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#1 ODDBALL27A1

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Posted 17 October 2003 - 11:56 AM

This is the ODDBALL27A1 we had much discussion over whether it's stainless or just extremely well burnished to the white.

Buddy and I took it to the range a couple of weeks ago and ran into the second round out of the 39-rd drum just having a slight dimple in the cap and not firing. Our guess was firing spring needs to be replaced.

Ordered online from Kahr and got it immediately! ($2.00) When I tried to remove the firing pin guide it had to be forced out because it was so badly disfigured because the old spring was now in THREE pieces and piled on top of its self.

Like an idiot I didn't replace the buggered guide and took the carbine to the range yesterday. One round out of the drum fired and that was it. The bolt returned to just where the ejector stopped it from traveling the remaining inch to close.

Now I can't get the ejector to allow the bolt to close so I can get the firing pin in the fired position as instructed in the owner manual.

Anyone got any info how I go about this? Any tips would be much appreciated.

---Jack

[QUOTE]The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of Patriots and Tyrants. ---Thomas Jefferson
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#2 TAB

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Posted 17 October 2003 - 01:02 PM

ummm, yeah, but it involves a box and a trip to Colorado .... if it were me
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#3 Brickyard

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Posted 17 October 2003 - 01:16 PM

I was gonna say that. Give PK a mail and see what he says. I know he'll do it right.
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#4 PK.

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Posted 17 October 2003 - 05:29 PM

Is the ejector in front of the bolt? Has it turned sideways?
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#5 Norm

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Posted 17 October 2003 - 05:56 PM

ODDBALL27A1,

I have to agree with Brickyard and TAB, send it to PK. The way you describe the gun's malfunction sounds serious. Also, PK may be able to shed some light on the unusual finish of the gun.

Is it jamed up with the drum locked on it?

Norm

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#6 Grey Crow

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Posted 18 October 2003 - 04:25 PM

The most difficult part of an issue like this is the inability to see the gun in order to know what the problem is.

In the future if anything like this were to happen again, (hopefully it won't) all of the working parts should be closely inspected for burrs, or a part that has become lodged that might lead to other problems. A good knowledge of the parts helps so that you can determine if a part has become damaged.

I wish I had an answer for you, but a gunsmith would be my first choice if it is locked up. Negating any further damage to the arm.
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#7 LIONHART

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Posted 18 October 2003 - 04:51 PM

I must confess that I have ruined a few projects by being in a hurry, not being careful enough, using the wrong tools, Ect. However one does tend to learn from his/her mistakes. That is what learning is all about. Like I have always said in the past here on this Forum, one should try and familiarize themselves with their Arms. What happens if there isn't a Smith around? I suppose you could use it for a heavy club, or discard it for another. What would happen if that one were to break??? I should think there would be someone out there that might be able to help Oddball out? I have sent him an email, and perhaps my method will prove successful. We'll see.
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#8 The1930sRust

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Posted 18 October 2003 - 06:09 PM

I agree some of us (me included) may be quick to say "send her off!". But that is only because many of the seasoned members here have been through the troubles that seem to be well beyond the capabilities of many of us. Still, looks like PK is trying to diagnose the problem here on the forum. Just waiting for an answer from oddball.
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#9 ODDBALL27A1

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Posted 18 October 2003 - 11:49 PM

Thanks for the replies, folks. I haven't had a chance to try LIONHART'S suggestion yet, but it does sound like it should work. The only disassembly guide I have to work with is the Kahr manual and it doesn't detail the removal of the ejector. I assume it means lifting the back end then turning the assembly to unscrew the ejector. There are no mags in the gun.

We're heavy into Biketoberfest here at the "World's Most Famous Beach" and I live just a few blocks from the heaviest concentration of bike traffic. Unfortunately it is directly in my path to get together at my buddy's place of business. It should all clear out after Sunday and I can concentrate on curing the Tommy's ills.

I'll get back to you with latest. Thanks again, LIONHART for your suggestions.

ODDBALL27A1
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#10 ODDBALL27A1

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Posted 19 October 2003 - 12:09 AM

In reply to your posting, PK, the ejector is about half an inch down in the bolt - and it appears to not be turned in any way. My ignorance of these guns, teamed with not having a good disassembly illustration makes it difficult for me to communicate with those who are old hands at taking these guns apart.

Looking at the underside of the bolt there is a narrow slot about 1/8" wide. Down inside that is what appears to be a machined bar, and which seems to me to have been loosely fitted in there (movable) when I had the gun apart previously. That bar does not move, and appears to be exactly where the ejector stops. Could this be part of the problem?

Thanks again for any help.

ODDBALL27A1
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#11 Grey Crow

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Posted 19 October 2003 - 06:15 AM

Oddball27A1,

From your description of the sliding bar when you look at the bottom of the bolt it sounds like you are looking at the firing pin, it should slide freely.

When you had the gun apart the last time by chance did the hammer fall out or not get placed back inside the bolt prior to reassembly? Without the hammer it could cause lack of impact to ignite the primer, and possibly damage the spring. ( the hammer is the cylindrical silver bar about an inch long )

Another issue I came across while fitting a new firing pin was that until it was filed down to proper dimensions it would catch on the sear preventing disassembly without force.
Unfortunately I do not have my gun at my disposal to look closely inside at this time.
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#12 PK.

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Posted 20 October 2003 - 08:53 AM

Oddball,

Please share with us Lionhart’s suggestion so that we may all be edified, and that it may be added to the body of this discussion.

Yes, the tail of the ejector must be raised and then the ejector unscrewed to remove it, but if the end of the ejector that projects into the bolt way is engaged in the slot in the bolt, this will not be possible. It sounds like that is the case and therefore it is unlikely that the ejector is interfering.

Graycrow has raised some good points; you don’t mention the “hammer” being present. It is a piece of rod about 7/16” in diameter and about 1” long that should go into the bolt against the firing pin prior to inserting the firing pin spring. If this part is missing, the gun will miss fire and the spring likely break. I am concerned that the firing pin (“machined bar” in the “1/8” slot”) was not moving when you disassembled the gun to replace the firing pin spring the first time. As stated, it should be free moving within the bolt when the spring is removed.

I fear that there may be pieces of the broken spring still present that have somehow lodged between the receiver, firing pin and bolt, jamming the bolt in place. Unfortunately, you will not be able to release the firing pin to effect disassembly of the frame / receiver until the bolt has moved forward into battery. Because the bolt jammed going forward, try to move it backward to un-stick whatever is holding it there. A wooden rod down the bore and easy persuasion with a hammer might do the trick. You must not force anything to the point of causing damage however. If you get the bolt to move beyond the stuck point, shake it to try to relocate any offending pieces and allow the bolt to move forward carefully.

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#13 The1930sRust

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Posted 24 October 2003 - 06:06 PM

In fairness to Oddball, I split this topic and placed the unrelated civil matters over on the non-TSMG related board.
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