TSMG28

Mad Machinist, The kit looks correct as a probable Chinese version. The PPS43 mags do not need modified, but the mag adapter does require modification to the trigger frame for its installation. Typically, the ejector does not need modification/extension. If you were to make an M1-style conversion, you could use the barrel for that. It sounds like you have a better approach for magazines than what the Chinese used in their 1928-style guns. The relief cuts on the lower sides of the bolt are only required to accommodate the feed lips of the PPS43 mag, which sits very high in the feed area. Feeding of Tokarev cartridges from the original WWII U.S.-made magazines (vary rare to find) or 9mm cartridges from UD42 mags, with the appropriate barrel and bolt of course, does not require these relief cuts. To answer your question about value, it is hard to say, since these kits are not sold that often. As Dan mentioned, the bolt in the kit that Richard had for sale was modified this year by him. It also had a new-made barrel, so the only period parts were the mag adapter and mag. It is hard to validate the age or source of these kits. Yours includes an actuator and Blish lock, and also what appears to be a modified lock. I would be interested to know if the actuator and bolt are of U.S. manufacture. They should be marked if they are. If not, and assuming the actuator is not a West Hurley cast actuator, that could add a little more to the value of your kit. I have seen these kits go for anywhere between $400 and $600, but it could be higher. Hope this helps.

I am very sad to hear that. I spoke with Lawrence several times this past year while working on my book, and he provided me with pics and information from his collection. I fine individual and avid Thompson collector.

Bob, Not a secret. Most of the WWII production numbers came from the National Archives. Frank Iannamico did a lot of research there, and I have copies from a number of different sources listing contracts and production information. Though there are some British numbers on this side of the pond in our archives, most of that information came from research James West did in the archives of the Imperial War Museum in Britain. I also found some information during my two visits to the archives at the National Firearms Centre in Leeds, England. I still hope to also visit the IWM archives in the future to see what else I can find. Most of the information about the Colt-era magazines came from records kept by the Thompson, Eickhoff, Payne, and Goll families that now reside here in Ohio. Hope that helps. Roger

Now that Tracie & Donnas Show and Shoot is past, I thought I would bring this topic back to the top. For those of you that purchased my book on Amazon, I would appreciate you posting a review for me. If you still want a signed copy of my book, please send me an Email at roger.herbst@att.net, and I will provide you with payment information. Thanks to all who have purchased the book! Dont hesitate to provide me with any additional or updated information. Roger

The JC Earl comp appears to attached the same way the Ruger Mark I comp attaches to those guns. The front sight pin is removed. The comp slides from the front over the barrel and around the front sight, and a longer pin is installed through the comp and front sight. Since Ruger started making/selling their comps at the end of 1954, that example would have been available to JC Earl when he was developing his Thompson add-on comp. I do not know about any threading of early barrels, but the barrel boss on 1921A's was straight, not tapered, and nominally 0.750 inches in diameter. The sight slides over the boss and is then pinned in place, so the same process could be used whether the barrel boss is solid or threaded. Based on the pics of the boss at the back of the sight on 562, that area certainly appears to be threaded. As mentioned by Tom, you should be able to see the gun serial number stamped at the breech end of the barrel, at least partially, by using a strong light and looking with a magnifier through the ejection port. That will confirm whether the barrel is original to the gun. It is certainly possible to remove a Colt-era barrel and re-install it to line up perfectly. I have seen it done more than once when using appropriate tools. FWIW Roger

If your grip mount is an original (likely), it is 14-24 as noted above. However, I did own a WWII vet-bringback 1928, amnesty registered, that had a field-created non-standard grip mount, which was threaded 1/4-20. My guess is that the 1/4-20 thread tap was all that was available at the time the mount was created. Because the mount was not as strong as an original, they had also added the foregrip reinforcing band. Just wanted to let you know that alternate threads may have been used in some instances, though my example is the only one I have seen that did not have a standard grip mount. FWIW Roger

Dan, I have never seen a single chest for the M1 Thompson. I own a two-gun transit chest for M1s, which is plenty heavy when loaded.

MrBill, We have a letter from Colts to Savage in November 1939 that indicates that Colts was still manufacturing/supplying a lot of spare parts for Auto-Ordnance. That particular letter does not include barrels, but does include all of the lower and upper receiver internals, plus XX and L magazines. Therefore, it is certainly possible that they were also providing replacement barrels at that time.

It appears that the barrel was replaced at some point before it left Britain, based on their proof marks on it. If the barrel had been swapped in the U.S., it is unlikely that they would have used a British-proofed solid barrel. Yes, the original barrel would have been finned. The British are also known for force matching trigger frame numbers to the receiver, as was done here. That is often done even with deactivated guns in Britain. As already noted, at least the trigger frame is from another early Savage. We will have to wait to see if it sells at that price. I would not be surprised if it does.

Is someone able to verify the pedigree of this gun? It appears to me that the receiver has been carefully modified from a 1928 to a 1921. I recall that there were 1921 overstamps, but the shadow of the 8 behind the 1 suggests to me that this was someone's attempt to make a standard 1928 gun more valuable. If the actuator looks like a Colt's, I would definitely not shoot it!

I suspect that both the front and middle parts are Colt's, though obviously not matching. According to Gordon, both Colt serial numbers 1210 and 12154 went to Mexico and were later destroyed. The parts sets were then imported back into the U.S. My guess is that when the sets were brought back into the U.S., there was no effort to match up the parts. I do not know enough about hidden Colt's serial numbers to know the significance of the K. I agree with Mohawk64. The barrel does look bulged. The rear sight outline on the back piece certainly seems to indicate a WWII fixed sight was originally on that part.

Ryo, I bought one from that site and had no issues. Also had not heard of them, but they appear to be a distributor of some kind. FWIW

Firearm, Looks like a very nice example of a British proofed and modified gun with all of the right marks. It is very similar to my first Thompson, which is also British proofed. Overall finish looks original. The proofed barrel is a big plus. Many of these guns got dewatted in the 1950's when they came into the country, which generally meant the barrel was made non-functional and was later scrapped when the gun was rewatted. The swivel on the right side of the foregrip is typical. Even though the formal instructions were to place the swivel on the left side, it appears that the side chosen differed depending on the person doing the work and/or the one requesting it. I have seen a number of both horizontal and vertical foregrips with the swivel on either side. The sling date looks to me to be 1943, which would be closer to the issue date of this gun, which was likely 1942 or late 1941. Of course, slings wore out or were damaged, and got replaced periodically, so a later date is still fine. The Savage knurled safety and selector are a nice touch. I am also interested in what price you will be putting on this gun.

Pauliedweasel, Yes, the rotor/retaining clip is identical on both the C and L drums. I was not successful locating someone selling that part. You might reach out to Bob at PhilaOrd to see if he got any from Doug Richardsons estate.

As SP Sarge discovered, the hard cover version of my book just went live today on Amazon. If you want a signed copy sent to you, please send me an Email at roger.herbst@att.net. I have just sent information to those that were on my list of people wanting a hard cover version. Check you Email or messages.

Jack reminded us two weeks ago about the upcoming signup deadline. It is now only one week away. If you want to attend the All Thompson Show & Shoot this August, make sure to get your reservation to Tracie by June 1.

Uncle Dudley, No, the V was added by all U.S. mag manufacturers in the latter half of 1942, supposedly as an encouragement to both the workers and fighting men.

You are not missing anything. Just two bidders going against each other who HAD to have this mag. Looks like a standard Colt Patent Date to me. Certainly not worth $901. A lot of buyers out there have more money than sense. Then again, they havent made any of these since 1939, so at some point it may be worth that, especially with inflation.

It is a current dummy mag made by Denix of Spain. It is very crude, including mold lines, and cannot even correctly hold the dummy rounds made by the company.

Countryboy77, I am not surprised to hear your father's experience. I seriously doubt Numrich made any modifications to their drum magazines for the 10mm. Not worth the retooling, especially with so few actually sold. The person who I know that saw one did see the 10mm overstamp on the front faceplate, but I do not know if that was done consistently. As I note in my book, as near as I can tell, the only differences with the 10mm XXX box magazines are the 10MM stamp on the bottom of the floorplate and a notch cut in the follower tab. I assume the notch was to allow the last round to get out of the magazine. Not having a 10mm gun or experience with semi-auto Numrich guns, I cannot confirm that, but it seems logical to me. FWIW

Sadly, the hard cover edition will be delayed at least a month due to Amazon lead times. Therefore, those wanting that option will have to wait until at least early June, and possibly longer. I do not know if this has to do with the hard cover option still being in beta, or whether they are still working out the kinks, or perhaps where and how they assemble the books. Out of my control. Good point Richard! That old publishing adage was true on this side of the pond as well. First editions in hard cover, then eventually move to mass market via paperback. Publishing on-demand has apparently turned that around. It is much easier to publish a book in paperback than with a hard cover. The lead times I am seeing with this book reinforce that difference. Amazon (Kindle) did not even have a hard cover option for self-publish until the past year, and it has been in beta with a number of restrictions. My guess is that a majority of this kind of book will continue to be published primarily or only in paperback.

SP Sarge, Hopefully the hard cover will be available in the next week or two. Still have to sort through some of the Amazon details.

Just received notice in the past five days that three of my Form 4's had been approved. Two were 11 months old, and the other was 8.5 months. Interestingly, they were from two different dealers, but all three were approved by the same person on the same day. So perhaps the ATF is starting to get organized. Both dealers also said that their E-form 4's have been taking around 3 months from submission to approval. So, assuming that they keep that system tuned and running, wait times may be much better in the future. Forever hopeful....

Thanks everyone. Yes, Chuck, this was a labor of love, emphasis on the labor (and the love). To avoid filling up the PM system on the board, if you want to buy a copy from me and have it mailed to you, contact me via Email at roger.herbst@att.net. I also updated my original post with this information. I hope to have the hard cover option available in the next week or two, once I navigate the Kindle-verse.

Thanks, Mike. I will have a couple proofs at OGCA this Saturday for people to see. I will not receive the books to sell until the following week.