HANS
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HANS last won the day on July 27
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Has anyone seen details on how Thompsons were distributed at the squad level in that time? How many drums and magazines were issued? I've seen only a few photos and they seem at best inconclusive (sometimes you see two drum pouches, sometimes no pouches are visible at all, sometimes they have box magazines in the weapon, etc). Presumably things evolved as more guns became available, but even that is unclear. Would someone know? Many thanks! Cheers HANS
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Gun Crazy- Bonnie & Clyde
HANS replied to OCM's topic in Gangsters, Outlaws & Lawmen of the Early 20th Century Forum
Yeah, the photo you mentioned has been widely published, but not in GO DOWN TOGETHER. It shows Deputy Sheriff Rogers of the Bienville Parish Sheriff’s standing next to a pile of guns and ammo. It shows the "left-overs" I mentioned: 2 M1918 BARs, 1 FN-Browning Auto-5, 3 Colt M1911, and 1 Colt M1909. Plus stacks of BAR magazines and much ammo, primarily .30-06 on stripper clips. Cheers HANS -
Gun Crazy- Bonnie & Clyde
HANS replied to OCM's topic in Gangsters, Outlaws & Lawmen of the Early 20th Century Forum
Posse leader Hamer picked only half of the guns. How do I know? This is the complete arsenal: 3 M1918 BARs 1 FN-Browning Auto-5 in 16-gauge (this was supposedly damaged beyond repair during the shootout) 1 Remington Model 11 in 20-gauge 7 Colt M1911 2 Colt Pocket Hammerless (.32 and .380 ACP) 1 Colt M1909 (1 Colt Detective Special was sold as having been there as well, but is very conspicuously absent from all period accounts and photos; I consider it a fake.) There are several photos that suggest that Hamer ended up with only 1 M1918 BAR, 1 Remington Model 11, and 4 Colt M1911. Hamer's son also only mentioned 1 M1918 BAR in his 1968 interview. Notably, when Hamer's son showed off his father's guns in that interview, he had none of the above to show, only other guns including, infamously a Remington Model 81 that cannot have been there. He later sold a Remington Model 11 that he claimed came from the Death Car, but the serial number is wrong. There is one photo that shows 2 M1918 BAR, 1 FN-Browning Auto-5, 3 Colt M1911, and 1 Colt M1909. The Colt M1909 ended up with a deputy sheriff, and I believe all of rest ended up with someone else; the military guns were possibly returned. The two pocket pistols were pocketed (hah) by posse member Hinton, according to his son. Cheers HANS -
Thanks Kevin! I remember talking with you about gunsmith Lebman and his designs many years ago (back then everybody including myself was convinced that all those things were the handiwork of Lebman, but as you've read I've since discovered that may not have been the case). I think you were primarily interested in Colt pistols then, right? I am still working on publishing my findings, such as they are, about the machine pistol conversions. Hopefully one day they will be ready ... Cheers HANS
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Chipotle publish a lot of cool stuff. Would someone know whether they have a store in/near Las Vegas? Their offices are in Henderson, as far as I can tell. I would be thrilled to pick up some items while I'm there; shipping to Europe is generally very costly. Many thanks! Cheers HANS
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Thanks David, I've read that of course. I've also read the accounts in Swearengen's THE WORLD'S FIGHTING SHOTGUNS and TEAR GAS MUNITIONS. Unfortunately, none of these accounts deal with production figures or serial numbers. As I said, the serial numbers I've seen so far suggest a much more substantial production than I thought, but there could be other explanations -- for example, the serials could include those of the M512 revolvers or some such. Cheers HANS
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I've never seen production numbers for the Manville Gas Guns in 12-gauge and 25mm. I found serial numbers for the latter between No.787 and No.2017, which suggests a pretty substantial production for a weapon that nobody seems to have used (except for two National Guards and a couple police departments, as far as I can tell). I've even seen No.33322, but I'm assuming that's a mistake or some other special case. I haven't seen a single number for a 12-gauge gun. So what gives? Does anyone have more information? Failing that, does anyone have additional serial numbers that would allow us to form an opinion as to likely production totals? Many thanks! Cheers HANS
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Mob Museum Las Vegas
HANS replied to HANS's topic in Gangsters, Outlaws & Lawmen of the Early 20th Century Forum
Thanks for mentioning this event. Unfortunately I'm only looking at May next year, so Big Sandy is out. I may go to Ohio instead though, any suggestions there? Many thanks! Cheers HANS -
Mob Museum Las Vegas
HANS replied to HANS's topic in Gangsters, Outlaws & Lawmen of the Early 20th Century Forum
Thanks Ron! I had originally planned to fly out to Missouri and check out some outlaw items and pay an extended visit to Ozark Machine Guns, but since Tyler's range seems to be closed I've been looking at other options. I'm thinking Las Vegas might be fun overall (even though I neither drink or gamble), there are a couple of machine gun ranges with nice rentals, some of the desert trips look cool, the Punk Rock Museum seems interesting, and while I'm there I might as well check out the Mob Museum. If they actually have the complete Goddard collection, it might be worth inquiring about seeing the non-SVDM stuff as well. Cheers HANS -
South Saint Paul Thompson #7744 #8251
HANS replied to mondabottle's topic in Thompson Submachine Gun Message Board
No. 8251 was not stolen by the Barker-Karpis Gang from responding officers outside the Post Office in 1933; Roger Cox claimed that in his book but he was wrong. They took No. 7679. Cheers HANS