drm2m

http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/TheGermanschangedtheMP40fortheMP44andtheLugerfortheP38.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/TheMP40andtheLugerP08werereplacedwi.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/180kbsMP40MagazineMarkings011-1.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/mp40_0027.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/240kbsLighterDSC04645.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/MP40Magazinepouchmarkings019.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/156kbsfrontbdrMagpouch039-2.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/DSC04707-1.jpg The MP40 and MP44 are both Erma assembled guns. http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/DSC01109.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/204kbsDSC04695.jpg MP40 Erma assembled 1943. David

Roscoe, You are right...once upon a time they all seemed cheap. The world of faking is alive and well....it presents a minefield to new (and old) collectors. If you were a Luger collector....look at how careful one must be today regarding Navy marked Imperial Lugers.. There is a continual debate regarding the correctness of these guns. I never got into Navy Lugers for this reason.....they are also very costly. I decided to to stick with an Artillery Luger...less problems. (DWM 1917 chamber dated.) And fortunately...this one is unit marked...with one matching magazine. I figure "thanks to lady luck"...I am ahead of the game...and that is where I stop. http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/275kbspistolandholsterDSC01687-2.jpg Some accessories associated with the Artillery Luger. (LP08) http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/LP08andaccessories-1.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/208kbstopviewDSC007091.jpg Unit marking is 122nd Fusiliers Regiment (Wurttemberg) 4th Kompagnie (Company), # 6th Waffen (Weapon) "122 FÜSILIER REGIMENT (4.WURTTEMBERG) (122.R.4.6.)" http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/192kbsArtilleryUnitMarkingsongri-1.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/BarrelSerialNumberBest.jpg Matching magazine. http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/LP08Matchingmagazine.jpg ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ I am not really a Luger collector...but I consider myself very lucky to have found these two P.08s. S/42 Mauser code 1937 and 1938 dated guns....both with two matching magazines. I think with the Artillery Luger and these two P.08s.....that will be the end of my Luger adventure. http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/1937and1938S42P08sbothhavetwomat-3.jpg The matching magazines for these two P.08 Lugers. http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/1937and1938matchingLugermagazinesSD.jpg Chamber dates on these two S/42s. http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/1937and1938datedMauserCodeS42P08s.jpg Serial numbers on these two Lugers. http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/DSC05195.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/DSC05126.jpg ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ My how the U.S. carbine and sidearms have changed over the years. Inland M1A1 carbine, 12-42. (To enlarge the image click on the bar first ----then click again on the image.) http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/DSC05852.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/Picture003-2.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/DSC08744-3.jpg New Model 1863 Sharps carbine, altered after the Civil War in 1867 to the 50-70 center fire cartridge for use during the Indian War period. http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/SharpsCarbinerightreceivermarkin-1.jpg 50-70 cartridges for the Sharps carbine shown at the top of the photo below......different than for the M1A1 carbine. http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/DSC08682-1.jpg Cartridge box for the Sharps carbine....certainly different than the M1A1 carbine magazine pouch. http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/DSC08689-2.jpg --------------------------------------------------------------------- Some other carbines from this period. http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/CopyofDSCN0009.jpg ____________________________________________________________ Two U.S. military marked Colts from different eras-- 1942 and 1863. http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/ColtM1911A11942DSC01314-2.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/DSC08835.jpg David

Ric and Roscoe, Thanks for adding the photos of your M1A1s.....nice examples! These are quite interesting guns.....I think. I was quite pleased and surprised to find this M1A1 carbine in Canada….I had read a little regarding the availability of these guns in the U.S…..and before I bought this gun I passed the sellers photos by Bruce Canfield….to try and get a sense of what I was looking at with regard to these early guns. Based on the sellers photos ..Bruce very kindly took the time to give me his opinion….as best that he could …so I then decided to buy the gun....with my fingers crossed as the sellers photos were not that great. I also had great advice and insight from Jim Mock and Ted Tsyme from the M1 Carbine Club. I had previous experiences with these two guys regarding Bavarian Carbines.....of which I own two. Jim is the "main man" in that regard. I have added some additional stuff regarding the Colt M1911A1 rig and the vet that brought it back in the first post of this thread....for they that may be interested. David

Thanks Jim and Ric. There is an interesting provenance story associated with the M1911A1 rig...(See the end of the first post in this thread.) Ric, These are the photos I have in my photo archive for this M1A1 carbine....I hope they help you. David http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/DSC04404.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/DSC04303-1.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/DSC04398.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/DSC04419.jpg

Roscoe, The interesting part about this passion....is that you singled out some very special pieces that you remember in a very particular way. Perhaps... it is like a guy that was married many times.....when he reflects back on his memories of his favourite wives???? (Your MG42 is not included.) David NOTE; For many years I was principally a U.S. Civil War collector....in fact...I still am. I have never sold a piece ...so I don't know how that sense of divorce feels.

Roscoe do you regret having parted with that gun? It is so easy to look back and know.....hindsight is so clear. I am very leery about adding more converted autos to my collection as the current deactivation regulations are more stringent than what they once were. Two of my deactivated guns have fully functioning cocking and dry firing actions that is no longer possible. They are both in superb condition with wonderful markings. This means nothing for people that are used to live full auto guns. It is like taking a shower with your socks on.....or having no feet.....for the socks! They were alive and well until they were given a vasectomy. These guns remain a reflection of history....perhaps having been there...and done that? And then we wake them up from a deep sleep and try and shoot them in 2009. The deactivated guns in Canada "perhaps" command the same ...if not a greater price than live guns...with a much greater buying audience....the demand for this stuff is alive and well as the supply is limited. If you pay $5,000 CDN for a nice gun...that is alot. (This applies to a live full auto/converted auto or a deactivated gun.) Canada is a very different world compared to the U.S. in this regard. The demand/supply dynamic for original pre 68 C&R guns in the U.S. perhaps explains that. Canada is "perhaps" more like the U.K. and Australia....except that most live Milsurp and hunting guns are still very much permitted in Canada. (Including handguns.) The four full auto guns that I own in a converted to semi auto configuration are shown below. I don't know what the regulations will be like when it comes time to part with them....I am not looking forward to that day. David http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/Croppedresizedfullleftsideofgunanda.jpg I don't think many of these British Lanchester Mk1* smgs (full auto only-no selective fire) found their way into the U.S. http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/BritishWWIILanchestersubmachinegun.jpg Original finish on these Lanchester smgs is not common....this one is original I think? http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/Topofmaghousingmarkings-1.jpg The 50 round magazines for the Lanchester smg. (9mm Parabellum) http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/FiftyroundLanchestermagazines-restr.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/LanchesterPhotosDecember42005011-1.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/240kbsLighterDSC04645.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/WWIIGermanMP44-thefirstassaultrifle.jpg

In answer to your questions Roscoe. Yes I live in Canada. Both the MG42 and the MG34 have been deactivated I bought the MG42 from the gun smith that deactivated the gun from full auto....the gun was then legally deregistered. Full auto ownership in Canada is grandfathered....the cut off date was January 1 1978...I did not own a legal registered full auto at that time. As of January 1 1978 I believe there were 5000 legally registered full autos in Canada. I am licensed to own full autos that have been legally converted to semi auto. I have four guns that fit into this category and are registered as such. Permits to transport full auto or converted auto guns to a range are no longer available. Transfer of ownership of these types of guns is restricted to buyers that are licensed (grandfathered) to own either full auto or converted autos.....these are two distinctly different categories. Deactivated guns do not currently require any kind of registration…(for now) so anyone can own them. It is a pretty restricted market for live machineguns in Canada.....and gradually shrinking as time passes. David

http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/DSC04299-1.jpg The leather. http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/264kbsleatherDSC04332-2.jpg The stock markings. http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/292kbscrossedcannonsDSC04364-2.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/280kbsPmarkingDSC04315-1.jpg Receiver markings and serial number. http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/DSC04301-1.jpg Barrel date. http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/188kbsbarreldatemarkingsDSC04306-2.jpg Butt plate markings. http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/DSC04330.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/260kbsfullrightsideDSC04352.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/DSC09431-1.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/DSC05852.jpg Two other partners from 1942. Thompson M1928A1-manufactured Jan-Feb 1942. http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/DSC05120-1.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/CroppedresizedcloseupLeftsideins-1.jpg M1911A1 Colt delivered to the Springfield Armoury on June 25th 1942. Sn. 785826 ...W.B. inspected. http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/624kbsDSC04625.jpg This M1911A1 Colt rig was brought by this vet (the fellow on the right)....he was an American that enlisted in the R.A.F. before the U.S. entered the war. It is an interesting story.....I have a lot of photos and background material on this fellow.....and his service. http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/DSC01654.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/EnglandperhapsDSC01880-1.jpg (To enlarge the image...click on the bar first.. then click again on the image.) http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/RAFFerryCommandCertificate.jpg R.A.F.F.C. as shown on the buttons is for Royal Air Force Ferry Command. http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/DSC01055.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/DSC01666-1.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/84kbsthreemagazinesshowingColt45Aut.jpg The vet's name on his gear. http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/268kbsTobinsnameonpouchesDSC02313.jpg R.A.F.F.C. on the rear of the holster...with the vet's name. http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/DSC01154.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/DSC01092.jpg The vet's Pilot's Flying Log Book. (Full of stories.) http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/GSTobinsPilotsFlyingLogBookDSC02537.jpg Some of the aircraft he flew. http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/AircraftflownbyCaptGSTobin-1.jpg Some of the routes he flew. http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/DSC00871.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/DSC01054.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/DSC01053.jpg An ammunition delivery to Cairo prior to the Battle of El Alamein in Egypt. (To view the image clearly-click on the bar..then click again on the image.) http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/Tobinphoto32.jpg A little WWII history revisited that involved "Ferry Command" to some degree. “The campaign in North Africa as we well remember had many ups and downs and during one of the “downs” Ferry Command was called to fly in great haste, a large quantity of ammunition required for the stand at El Alamein. A large fleet of Liberators took over this work and these group pictures are of the crews that operated them.” (the photo above is one of several.) The photo above shows some of the "Ferry Command" crews that were involved in this mission…….there were others. The caption under the photo above; “The final briefing before departure. The A.O.C.-in-C. tells the senior crew members that the job they are about to do is vital and very urgent.” The Battle of El Alamein, fought in the deserts of North Africa, is seen as one of the decisive victories of World War Two. The Battle of El Alamein was primarily fought between two of the outstanding commanders of World War Two, Montgomery, who succeeded the dismissed Auchinleck, and Rommel. The Allied victory at El Alamein lead to the retreat of the Afrika Korps and the German surrender in North Africa in May 1943. El Alamein is 150 miles west of Cairo. By the summer of 1942, the Allies were in trouble throughout Europe. The attack on Russia - Operation Barbarossa - had pushed the Russians back; U-boats were having a major effect on Britain in the Battle of the Atlantic and Western Europe seemed to be fully in the control of the Germans. El Alamein was a last stand for the Allies in North Africa. By November 2nd 1942, Rommel knew that he was beaten. Hitler ordered the Afrika Korps to fight to the last but Rommel refused to carry out this order. On November 4th, Rommel started his retreat. Twenty five thousand Germans and Italians had been killed or wounded in the battle as well as 13,000 Allied troops in the Eighth Army. David

Two Gustloff assembled guns-MG42 1943 dated and MG34 1939 dated. Gustloff's code "dfb" on the 42 and "936" on the 34. http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/DSC01121-1.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/MG42dewatGustloffassembleddated1943.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/MG42showingGustloffs1943codeDSC0930.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/272kbsTopcoverSnwaA-2.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/MG42dewatcockandclickdeactivationDS.jpg MG42 sling markings. http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/DSC05781.jpg MG34 receiver markings. http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/Gustloffscode936WaA4onMG34sin1939.jpg The MG42 shown with some other German stuff. http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/1944datedP38hardshellholster.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/244kbsMG42ammunitionbeltonMG34MG42b.jpg David

Thanks for the photos Roscoe. This stuff becomes more collectible as time marches on…I think???? I will be very interested to hear about what you find regarding your guns. The more we learn about our stuff...the better off we are. And once we find out....we should record it somewhere....I don't know about you...but if I don't write it down somewhere...I will surely forget it. I find I am updating my info sheets as soon as I learn something I did not know.....if it sounds correct. I kept Claus and Reidar's emails for that reason. I was once considering purchasing an MP41 and Reidar's info was greatly appreciated....I did not buy the gun. Claus was hugely helpful when one of my collector friends was trying to research an M1 carbine with German (WaA)markings (not the post war Bavarian carbine markings).....the story regarding the Germans use of captured weapons. My friend Jim Mock is the guy that has the superb "Bavarian M1 carbine" web site...that maybe some of you are aware of. Jim is the "go to" guy with regard to these guns. Pretty interesting stuff. David

Thanks Roscoe, The issue of the stock Sn. question and the absence of any reference to it in the reference book I own...either to suggest that it was not common practice ....until the post war period....was what prompted my initial question. I do not own other books on this subject….so Hendrich is my sole resource. The reference to the DDR 1001 magazine marking is quite clear.....the stock issue is not......unless I am missing something....perhaps I have? Perhaps I have seen too many post war marked guns...that may well be the case? I have just not heard an authoritative source say....WWII MP44 gun stocks were definitely never marked that way. Anyway I don’t wish to beat this subject to death….I appreciate your patience in this regard. With regard to the internal parts on the MP44....if I understand Claus correctly some parts were blued ...some were not. I am curious to know what you find on your guns Roscoe. I saw a gun last weekend....very nice...it had all the issues that I have been questioning. That also may be prompting my questions. David It is one thing to shoot these guns....it is another thing to really take a real good look at them....and their markings. I have heard of guys that spent huge amounts of money on this stuff and they know nothing about who manufactured their gun....perhaps it doesn't really matter???

Roscoe, Since I bought these MP44s I have had the occasion to correspond with Claus Espeholt in Denmark regarding a number of different gun related subjects….one of which involved an attempt to find the missing MP44 parts from this parts pouch…no luck so far.. -------------------------------------------------------------------- David Spare parts: You need a extractor pin and extractor spring (+ a brush and the little manual and a muzzle cover) claus ------------------------------------------------------------------------ It was the stock marking SN. question that prompted me to post this thread. ------------------------------------------------------------------- Some of Claus's comments From the beginning of the production all MP44 parts were blued - later both yes or no. I have for example some late (I presume) ejectors laying here and they are all blued. claus "The internal parts of an MP44 were electro-penciled and often not blued." (13/10/2006) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- When I bought the Erma assembled MP44 I got a number of ammunition packets…some East German…some repacked Czech ammo that was original WWII German stuff that I have never opened. The continuing challenge is to find original well marked MP44 magazine pouches that pass more than the sniff test. My MP40 mag pouch came from Norway (From Reidar- a.k.a.Bergflak)….and all this original stuff is getting increasingly more difficult to find…..and definitely not inexpensive....particularly a matched well marked pair! Both Claus and Reidar have been very helpful with valuable advice over the years. http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/DSC00348-3.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/212kbsMP44ammo-1.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/MP44Bookphoto002.jpg

Thanks for your response Roscoe. Yes I have Handrich’s book. I was not able to find any references to serial number markings on the stocks. I did find out that the two MP44s that I own each reflect the different variations of the stocks shown in his book. The stock on the Erma and the Steyr are distinctly different. As far as “blued” VS "in the white" finish on internal parts....I could not find anything that was definitive in the book....perhaps I missed it? David

Erma assembled MP40, dated 1943, Sn. 9428u. Barrel markings, Erma’s code WaA280 (three times), Sn. 9428, and Eagle firing proof. Rear top of receiver MP40, ayf 43, cos. Trigger guard plate-cos, Sn. 9428, WaA44 stamp for Merz Werk. (Click on the bar to enlarge the images....then click again on the image to enlarge them.) http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/WWIIGermanMP40submachinegun.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/204kbsDSC04695.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/DSC04707-1.jpg Magazine pouch. Richard Ehrhardt Lederwarenfabrik, Possneck, Thüringen. Manufacturer’s code “bdr” (his code in 1942-1944) One of the belt loops shows MP38 u. 40 with” bdr 42”. The other strap shows a WaA86 acceptance stamp. http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/156kbsfrontbdrMagpouch039-2.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/MP40Magazinepouchmarkings019.jpg Various coded magazines. http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/280kbsMP40MagazineMarkingsandPou-1.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/268kbsac42andMP40DSC03972.jpg David One of the MP44s shown below in a previous thread and this MP40 are both Erma assembled guns.

Were internal parts i.e. bolt etc blued or supplied in the white? Were WWII stocks serial numbered with the gun? I have heard various opinions regarding these two questions. Some sub contractors blued their internal parts...some did not??? Refurbed guns....probably blued parts....probably numbered stocks??? I am trying to get a sense of how these guns were when they were originally assembled. Any thoughts on these two questions would be appreciated. David http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/ErmaMP44boltetcPA020016.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/ErmaMP44SnonthestockDSC00203.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/ErmaunderreceiverserialnumberMP4404.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/ErmaMP44WWIImarkings.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/ErmaMP44Snonreceiver002.jpg Erma assembled gun...late war code "qlv". http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/ErmaMP44CAcodeqlvE280DSC00181.jpg A Steyr late code gun "SWJ" ...WaA 623. The first chapter of this guns life was in WWII as the Nazi period markings suggest...the second chapter was in the DDR...post war. http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/SteyrMP44dewatcodeSWJWaA623DSC08975.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/SteyrMP44latewarcodeSWJWaA623underr.jpg East German starburst VOPO marking on the Steyr MP44 together with a few photos of VOPO police. http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/EastGermanVOPOmarkingontheSteyrMP44.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/VOPO20K98-1.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/Bundesarchiv_Bild_183-33349-0002-1.jpg http://i530.photobucket.com/albums/dd346/drm2m/nva20stg44-1.jpg