TD.

Excellent advice by Doug Quaid, above, on obtaining a NOS spring kit for your "new" M1A1. I am not a big proponent of changing out the springs just because they are old, but having an NOS set available at the first sign of issues is a great idea. Actually, I would suggest buying two spring kits. One to eventually use and the other as a spare (that you will probably never need). The best source for genuine NOS Thompson spare parts including all the springs is forum member Phil Askew. He can be reached at: philfordparts@yahoo.com. Or you can visit with Phil in person at the Hill Family All Thompson Show & Shoot later this year. You will enjoy seeing all the parts Phil brings to the show.

S-52127 is definitely an old war horse. The stories it could tell. Thank you for sharing. I agree about the safety lever and magazine catch. I believe the vertical fore grip is a SILE reproduction fore grip. The ejector is the early milled type and the actuator is knurled so both correct for this time period. While undiscernible, the right side receiver should have the New York address. I also believe it should have a Type 2 compensator. The GEG inspector mark on the left side receiver is still visible. I believe I see where the original sling swivel location cut out at the bottom of the butt stock has been filled with a wooden plug - excellent workmanship. S-52127 is a Cash & Carry British Ministry of Supply (MoS) purchase that was probably manufactured around December 1940. I would buy S-52127 for a display piece if I could get approval to import it into the USA.

Before jumping on the Auto-Ordnance West Hurley conversion kit, I would ask deerslyer and/or TSMG28 if this kit is for the full auto submachine gun or semi-automatic carbine/pistol. They can also tell you if it really works. I believe it is for the semi-auto carbine, but this is not my area of specialty.

Hyper Sniper, Welcome back to the Thompson forum. If you obtained the Spare Part Kit (SPK) from Gordon Curtiss, I would bet Mr. Curtiss obtained it from Roger Cox. If the SPK is original, one of the most common variations, is in really nice condition and contains original Colt era parts, then the price mentioned by Got Uzi, above, is possible - but very much at the top of the market. If you can post some pictures, I know forum members can offer a more accurate opinion of pricing. Be aware that fakes exist. And two of the variations will not command top dollar but are none the less original. If you decide to post pictures, I want to see a close up of the front and back of the rivet attaching the latch. I also want to see a clear picture of the hinges, top and bottom. I have written extensively on the SPK. My Amateur's Guide book tells of the history of the SPK and examines what I believe is the most common (and valuable variation). It also addresses the Gordon Herigstad reproduction kit. My 3rd book goes into detail on the last two variations as well as fakes with a follow up on the Herigstad reproduction SPK. Knowledgeable buyers will most likely have both books. The pictures tell the story. It is good way to authenticate your SPK and will aide if you ever decide to sell it. If you live close to Ohio, attending a Thompson association Show & Shoot later this year will offer you the opportunity to have the SPK examined by knowledgeable members in this area. And you will have a lot of fun. I guarantee it!

Hi Guys, I just noticed that Amazon.com is running a sale on my first book, Great Britain - The Tommy Gun Story, for $20. This is a better price than I can offer at the Thompson shows. Amazon.com: Great Britain - The Tommy Gun Story: 9781502977816: Davis Jr., Tom: Books I have no idea how long the sale will last.

Skip Greenwade, Congratulations! Now you need to join The American Thompson Association (TATA) and attend the Hill family Show & Shoot later this year. We have another TATA and forum member that may chime in when he sees you are from Houston. I lived in the west side of Houston for a number of years. What part of Houston do you reside?

Roland, Thank you for the post. I have never heard of Richard Lee Clauss and his Thompson submachine guns. Has anyone else on the Board heard of him? Maybe own one?

Phil will certainly be missed by all. Thank you for posting Tracie.

I think it would be best to distinguish between the Colt, Model of 1928 and the M1 series of Thompson guns when talking about grip mounts and breakage. There is a section in Great Britain- The Tommy Gun Story beginning on page 60 that deals specifically spare parts for the Thompson gun used by the British military during World War II. I believe this is very important because the British military had a lot of experience with using the Thompson submachine gun in battle prior to the USA entrance into the war in December 1941. What I found was the British military only wanted a small number of spare parts per 100 guns ordered and received. The US wanted to greatly expand the number of parts and a bureaucratic battle of spares began that was fun to read (and write) about. I also included 5 charts developed during these discussions of the parts argued about starting on page 125. The grip mount or "Mounts, grip" is not even listed until the 4th chart. The number of spare parts listed for the "Mounts, grip" per 100 guns is "Nil" or none. If any "Mounts, grip" are needed, the source for this part is "Recover." I assume from battlefield used guns retrieved on the ground and refurbished for use after an engagement. The 5th chart is the U.S.A. Ordnance Scale (page 133), and it lists the requirement for (Mount, grip (Plates fore grip), as only 2 grip mounts per 100 guns during a 12-month maintenance schedule. The number of spares needed for many other parts are quite a bit more, i.e., barrels - 120 per 100 guns, actuators - 23 per 100 guns, etc. The resource material for the battle of spares is dated from 1940 through 1942 (see footnotes) and only encompasses the Model of 1928 and US Model of 1928 A1 Thompson submachine guns. There is a short reference in January 1943 on page 66 about a "new model" SMG being introduced and how spares for this new SMG would be under discussion in the future. I encourage all of you with, Great Britian - The Tommy Gun Story, that is interested in grip mounts and Thompson spare parts to review the above material. Perhaps I have missed something. All good stuff!!!

Dan, I believe this is variation #1, above. Can you describe the problem with this WH, and how you are going to correct it? I was thinking this early variation worked best. Thanks for all you do.

I agree with villafuego, the receiver in Kit A is a Richardson display receiver. This kit has the most value because of the Richardson receiver. Perfect for building a dummy gun or with the proper license, a Post Sample TSMG. The condition is poor but should clean up nicely. I suspect one of Doug's barrels and compensators too. I would guess $2500 retail only because of the receiver. The other kits or parts listed are from World War II. The condition of the barrel would be important in obtaining a retail price. If complete, I would guess between $1500 and $2000 retail for Kit B. I am curious if the rear of the bolt is marked: A.O.C. The other kits without the frame would most likely sell for a much lower price. Mismatched torch cut Thompson receiver pieces are very common and do not command a high price. Again, the condition of the outside and especially the inside of the barrel is very important. Check gunbroker.com for some cost comparisons. Good luck!

I wonder if what they are holding are not actually firearms but some type of radar gun. Or perhaps, a mace gun designed for crowds or prison/jail use.

2026 is going to be a great year!!!

KrazyKarl, Welcome to the Thompson forum. If you would post a few pictures of this M1A1 Thompson submachine gun, I am sure the many knowledgeable members on this forum would be able to provide you some excellent information. This particular gun may have been discussed previously. It sounds like a semi-auto Thompson carbine conversion to submachine gun based on your description and price. Pictures will tell the tale. May I suggest you be 100% sure what variation you are looking at before spending any money.

Merry Christmas Dan. Keep up the good work!

Kid0104, Welcome to the Thompson forum on MachineGunBoards.com. NO 9115 has been discussed on this forum previously. Shown below is one of the more interesting threads. Search on numbers 9115 in the search box and you will find additional information. Fortunately, it appears NO 9115 is on the Registry and in civilian hands. I have no idea of the current owner. Good luck!

I have no idea why the Tennessee Valley Authority (TVA) would purchase a Model 1928 West Hurley Thompson submachine gun in 1977, not 1975 as claimed. I did note a pinned compensator that may be a Type 2 compensator. The pictures are not clear enough to tell with absolute certainty. However, it does have a standard Numrich Arms 27 fin barrel. The actuator appears to be a World War II smooth ball but AOC West Hurley also had a smooth ball actuator. The rear sight is a WWII Lyman adjustable (that is a plus). The provenance to TVA is a sticker on a removable butt stock. If I was going to pay a premium price for a West Hurley Thompson submachine gun, I would want to see some documentation as to the prior owner(s). A Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) request may reveal prior government ownership but if I was interested, I would want to know where Collector's Firearms obtained it, and where the past owner obtained it. I would try to follow the trail back to Auto-Ordnance, West Hurley, New York. Those that live in or near Houston should visit Collector's Firearms. It is an amazing store. I remember their two old locations (on Richmond and Fondren I believe). I could spend hours in their store just looking. It was almost like a museum but near everything was for sale! If you happen to fly into Houston and can stay an extra day, rent a car and visit the store. It is on a major road (Westheimer), easy to find and well worth the effort.

Taliaferro - Great information. Chip - A very nice Colt NAVY! jedimonkey - If the mark is that small, a MACRO lens may be required. What is the location of this mark? How about a close-up picture with an arrow pointing to the location.

jedimonkey, Welcome to the Thompson forum on MachineGunBoards.com. Pictures would be a big help! My guess is either Enfield with the letter "E" mark or Birmingham with the "BP" mark. The marks under the Crown could be Inspector marks. A great book to own for the World War II Thompson submachine guns is, American Thunder, Third Edition, by Frank Iannamico. Another book for information on the British Cash & Carry and/or Lend Lease Thompsons is, Great Britain - The Tommy Gun Story, by Tom Davis, Jr. Both are available on Amazon.com and contain a wealth of information. Think Christmas presents!

If you're having trouble providing your loved ones with a Christmas list, a great reference book by Roger Herbst (TSMG28), above, would be an excellent choice. Availalable directly from Roger (contact via PM) for a signed copy - or on Amazon.com. This book will answer all your drum and magazine questions. Highly recommended!

Bob, Thank you for sharing. I too have never seen this picture. Given what appears to be volcanic ash, it appears the Marine who carried this Model of 1928 Thompson covered the actuator slot in an attempt to keep it operational. Since the Thompson is stuck in the ash beside a web belt of equipment and shovel, I wonder if the Marine was wounded and evacuated to the rear. It appears the other Marines in the picture are engaged in an active battle. From what I have read, US forces believed Iwo Jima would not take long to capture. Wrong on all counts.

gijive knows his Thompson guns! The above picture is from the 2009 movie, Public Enemies, starring Johnny Depp (shown below in a movie still). I was in New York City during the release of Public Enemies. The Thompson submachine gun was everywhere in Times Square! And on every other taxi!

Hi JEB007x, Welcome to the Thompson forum on MachineGunBoards.com. The Thompson pictured above appears to be a run of the mill World War II late production Savage Thompson submachine gun. One ugly part is the (pistol) grip which someone sanded to death! Based on the "INTERARMS ALEX VA" marking I would guess this Savage was a Pre-Sample machine gun imported by INTERARMS and sold after 1968. It may be one of the lucky Pre-Samples whose registration status recently changed to fully transferable because it was purchased by a law enforcement organization. The advertisement should tell you if there are any restrictions to ownership. The "A L 720" markings are not from the Savage factory or applied by Auto-Ordnance. I believe they are Australian military markings. I would guess INTERARMS purchased this Thompson from the Australian military when it was no longer needed for service. If you are interested in World War II Thompson submachine guns, I highly recommend Frank Iannamico's, American Thunder, Third Edition. It is available on Amazon and a steal at 40 bucks with a hardcover and dust jacket. Aside from The Thompson Encyclopedia series which includes Frank's work, it is the stand-alone authority on the World War II Thompson guns. Let me know if you're interested in other Thompson variations, i.e., Colt's, Savage Commercials, West Hurley's, Bridgeport Commercials, etc., and I can make other book recommendations.

Yes, I do have Gordon's 6th and final edition 2 volume set. I think we have beat this subject to death. You are welcome to believe what you want. While NO 15025 may have been prepared as part of the Swedish contract, it did not ship to Sweden. One reason I spent so much time developing the Swedish Colt's story was to see if I could find any 15,000 numbered Colt's in the Swedish 500 gun order. Unfortunately, no serial number lists were uncovered but it was still a very good story that has paid dividends in other areas of research. I have not found an owner of a Colt Thompson that would allow the removal of the compensator just to check for the threads or a second pin grove. If you know someone that will allow this, please pass this information along to me. If I do another story on a Colt Thompson with a "H" marked barrel, I will certainly identify the maker. All good stuff!!!

Tom, Yes, GH does specify the MODEL 1928 with a 1921A barrel. His deviation from the FOIA is that it sold in 1940 not 1939. What source was GH using that gave near identical FOIA info? What Gordon says in his 6th and final edition is NO 15025 "appears to be one of the Swedish order of 500 Colt Thompsons filled in January 1940." While Gordon may think it appears to be part of the Swedish order, NO 15025 never left the USA. While the FOIA does show the IRS Form 2 being filed on June 30, 1939, no copy of the Form 2 was provided. The FOIA information is also not specific as to when it was sold. Gordon is just guessing again. One reason I would like to find the current owner is to have them file another FOIA request. Perhaps additional information by a more experienced disclosure clerk will yield additional information. I know much more about what to ask for than I did in 2007. At some point after receiving #15025 the Government entity owner sent it back to the Maguire owned AOC for the Type II Cutts installation? Or some time between 1940 and 1972 the Cutts was installed? So who is responsible for the Cutts fitting to the original Colt 1921A barrel before or after #15025 was dewatted. We have no reason to believe NO 15025 was not originally sold by AOC with a Type 2 Compensator. We do know from the FOIA documentation NO 15025 was dewatted "w/Fluted BBL and Compensator." Without further research, I can think of another Overstamp with the letter A mark that was shipped by AOC with a compensator. Arizona Class Three dealer Tom Stewart provided you with the photos of #15025 for your 2008 SAR article and that you also used in your "Amateur's Guide", yes? He stated he was able to get the original factory barrel, then fitted with the Type II Cutts, from the seller. Did he tell you why he, or the seller, removed the Type II Cutts to show the mangled muzzle boss threading for the pic to be included in your article. No. There isn't a complete photo of the original barrel in the publications as only the muzzle with Type II is depicted. Whomever removed the barrel from the receiver replaced it with the repro "H" barrel and West Hurley Cutts Compensator? Did Numrich rewat #15025 with the "H" barrel and his Cutts? No, not Numrich Arms. While I am not going to mention names, I believe the vendor that rewatted NO 15025 should have known the "H" marked barrel was not original Colt's. Unfortunately, all the retro work done on #15025 precludes determining how the threads differ on a 1921A barrel and a 1932 barrel when a Type II Cutts was installed by AOC/Fenn. Retro work? Believe what you want. Back to Square 1... M17ap - Years after my SAR story on NO 15025 was published, I had a reader tell me my suspicions about the "H" marked barrel were correct. He told me the same information you cited in your post. He said Charles Hudak knew his barrels were almost identical to the Colt era barrels so he felt an obligation to mark the barrels. The vendor that did the rewat stated on the repair invoice the barrel was original Colt and charged $1500 just for the barrel. The then owner was not very happy with the work.