Marcel Banziger Posted November 15, 2011 Report Share Posted November 15, 2011 Greetings all! I am new here and was in fact forwarded to here from the Wehrmacht Awards forum. I have a question about my M1 Thompson to which I would like to get some opions. It's a de-activated one, according to the law, and it has serial number 152577. At the Wehrmacht Awards forum it was said my M1 is a nice original one though the experts can be found here so your opinions are very welcome!I also would like to know if it's possible to date this one by its serial number and if yes, from which year is my M1? Included are several pics of which some are not the best unfortunately due to my very crappy cam. Still I hope they're good enough for some opinions?! Thanks for any comments, good or bad!Best regards,Marcel http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6239/6336564153_94a8872c10_b.jpghttp://farm7.static.flickr.com/6103/6337321356_2745c2b117_b.jpghttp://farm7.static.flickr.com/6019/6336565751_102af92def_b.jpghttp://farm7.static.flickr.com/6054/6336566561_c3f12d5d51_b.jpghttp://farm7.static.flickr.com/6059/6337323800_0d007299ac_b.jpghttp://farm7.static.flickr.com/6052/6336568195_28602e0a81_b.jpghttp://farm7.static.flickr.com/6104/6336569231_d3ee8e5c11_b.jpghttp://farm7.static.flickr.com/6056/6336570013_11cf5cdeac_b.jpghttp://farm7.static.flickr.com/6232/6337314906_a3be45f85f_b.jpghttp://farm7.static.flickr.com/6040/6336559111_a398ce9a3f_b.jpghttp://farm7.static.flickr.com/6092/6337313872_8fa4da11b3_b.jpghttp://farm7.static.flickr.com/6047/6336556651_ae0a241e4a_b.jpghttp://farm7.static.flickr.com/6043/6336560719_7e2aecb0bd_b.jpg 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrylta Posted November 15, 2011 Report Share Posted November 15, 2011 (edited) Welcome to the board Marcel, Are you and the M1 in the USA? I'm at work and not near any books. What I see is a late model M1 judging by the hardware, as in the pin fire control leversand hooded front site. These features are generally seen on the M1A1. You do have a non cross bolted M1 stock which is M1. Do you know if you have a floating firing pin, there common to the M1, the M1A1 has a fixed firing pin machined in the bolt face.All in all, it's a very nice M1, can you rewatt it without a lot of trouble? Be safe and legal,-Darryl Edited November 16, 2011 by darrylta Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcel Banziger Posted November 15, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 15, 2011 Hello Darryl, First of all thanks for the quick reply! I'm not in the US but Europe so here all such weapons have to be de-activated when being in a collection....unfortunately. So I just stick to the law hehe About the floating or fixed firing pin, I don't know to be honest. I never took this one apart but just bought it as display item for my WWII collection. I am furthermore not a weapon expert anyway. Overhere you need a special permit to own an active weapon, which I don't have...so I never really got the chance to learn more about how they exactly work etc. Best regards and thanks for the comment! Marcel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james m Posted November 15, 2011 Report Share Posted November 15, 2011 (edited) Hello Marcel:I'm the guy that referred you over here from WAF. I'm sure you'll get all the help you need with your Thompson from a great bunch of collectors.Welcome and I hope you'll stick around.Jim Edited November 15, 2011 by james m Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Z3BigDaddy Posted November 15, 2011 Report Share Posted November 15, 2011 Welcome to the board! It looks like a very nice late war example. Nice purchase... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcel Banziger Posted November 15, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 15, 2011 Thanks Jim for re-directing me here...I already found lots of interesting threads here so I definitely will stop by regularly And thanks Z3BigDaddy, it's great to hear it's a nice late war M1. Does the serial number link to a production year or ..? Another question is if anyone knows a value on this one, knowing it's de-activated? It can 'dry-shoot' but that's all. I just wanna know if I paid a good price or perhaps even overpaid. Best regards,Marcel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Z3BigDaddy Posted November 15, 2011 Report Share Posted November 15, 2011 Sorry I'm not that smart... Other people here are... That being said there really is not any detailed serial number/production date info around that I know of. I just look at features, as already pointed by DA above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalbert Posted November 16, 2011 Report Share Posted November 16, 2011 I disagree that this is a late war model M1/M1A1. I believe it is an arsenal refinished, early war M1/M1A1 manufactured in 1942. The reason I think this is based on the packing list that was recently posted with 10 examples of serial numbers manufactured in December, 1942. Those serial numbers were in the 306500 serial number range. David Albertdalbert@sturmgewehr.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mnshooter Posted November 16, 2011 Report Share Posted November 16, 2011 (edited) For a refinished piece, those inspection stamps sure appear very crisp. Who knows.It's also interesting at the back of the receiver; almost no radius across the top rear and corners. Almost WH-ish. Edited November 16, 2011 by mnshooter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Z3BigDaddy Posted November 16, 2011 Report Share Posted November 16, 2011 Probably "re-arsenal" would be a better term? I didn't even pay attention to the number just the gun... My bad... 152 k does seem kinda low..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalbert Posted November 16, 2011 Report Share Posted November 16, 2011 For a refinished piece, those inspection stamps sure appear very crisp. Who knows.It's also interesting at the back of the receiver; almost no radius across the top rear and corners. Almost WH-ish. mnshooter, I see what you mean, but still much more of a radius exists on this WWII era M1 than on a West Hurley. It's possible that it wasn't arsenal refinished, but the finish appears very good, and the rear sight is most likely replaced from what was installed on it originally, althought I'm not sure of the exact date of transition from the "L" type rear sight to the new sight with the protective ears. David Albertdalbert@sturmgewehr.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hawkeye_Joe Posted November 16, 2011 Report Share Posted November 16, 2011 Ok, what do you mean by "hooded front site(sic)"???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stgw. 57 Posted November 16, 2011 Report Share Posted November 16, 2011 (edited) Hello Darryl, First of all thanks for the quick reply! I'm not in the US but Europe so here all such weapons have to be de-activated when being in a collection....unfortunately. So I just stick to the law hehe About the floating or fixed firing pin, I don't know to be honest. I never took this one apart but just bought it as display item for my WWII collection. I am furthermore not a weapon expert anyway. Overhere you need a special permit to own an active weapon, which I don't have...so I never really got the chance to learn more about how they exactly work etc. Best regards and thanks for the comment! Marcel Hi Marcel, That might be true for some EU countries, but definitely not for all of them! I'm from Europistan and I own 15 fully functional full auto firearms. Edited November 16, 2011 by Stgw. 57 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrylta Posted November 16, 2011 Report Share Posted November 16, 2011 Hooded rear site :-). picky picky.-Darryl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mnshooter Posted November 16, 2011 Report Share Posted November 16, 2011 Hello Darryl, First of all thanks for the quick reply! I'm not in the US but Europe so here all such weapons have to be de-activated when being in a collection....unfortunately. So I just stick to the law hehe About the floating or fixed firing pin, I don't know to be honest. I never took this one apart but just bought it as display item for my WWII collection. I am furthermore not a weapon expert anyway. Overhere you need a special permit to own an active weapon, which I don't have...so I never really got the chance to learn more about how they exactly work etc. Best regards and thanks for the comment! Marcel Hi Marcel, That might be true for some EU countries, but definitely not for all of them! I'm from Europistan and I own 15 fully functional full auto firearms. Pictures! Pictures! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcel Banziger Posted November 16, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 16, 2011 Thanks everybody for the comments! These did raise some more questions though, and sorry if these are stupid questions but I'm new in this and still have a lot to learn - What does arsenal refinished mean? Is it, while laying in stock being updated with new features perhaps? Like f.e. the new rearsight? - The number seems rather low.....this means it doesn't fit a late war M1 which mine is supposed to be? - "almost no radius across the top rear and corners. Almost WH-ish" - Can you explain this please? Sorry again for any stupid questions and thanks for all the help Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrylta Posted November 16, 2011 Report Share Posted November 16, 2011 Marcel, When I stated that it appeared to be a late model M1, I based that assumption from the M1A1 components on it. Bear in mind that these guns are roughly seventy year old military guns. Most have had parts replaced due to wearand tear over the years and refinished. I'm sure that dalbert's info on the serial numbers is correct as in it's birth date. For more info on the Military Thompson,you may want to invest in Frank's American Thunder II book for a detailed look at your M1. Your M1 does has the appearance ofa transitional M1 to M1A1 gun the way it's outfitted presently. As far as the refinish, all Thompsons were born with a blue or black oxide type finish since it was the cheapest finish available.When problems arose and the gun couldn't be repaired in the field, they were shipped to an arsenal setting for a make over.The armorers that rebuilt them were not concerned about replacing parts with the same style parts the gun was born with. In fact, a lot of Thompson parts are interchangeable between the 1928 and M1 models and sub model A1's. As far as the arsenal finish, they sand blasted the gun to remove corrosion and applied the more durable parkerizing as seen on your gun.Judging how intact your stamps and roll marking are, the finish must have been good and did not require a heavy blasting. The WH / West Hurley models were Auto-Ord's last FA Thompson production gun. They were built in the 70's and 80's and weregenerally fraught with machining errors/ short cuts that plagues this model to this day. I hope I've helped you more than confused you, again invest in some Thompson MG books, there's all kind of good infoout there that will make your gun more enjoyable with more knowledge. My 2 cents, Darryl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcel Banziger Posted November 17, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 17, 2011 Thanks a lot Darryl, very much appreciated! Your reply helped me A LOT and all my questions are answered. Also thanks for telling about the book Frank's American Thunder II, I definitely will get this one. I do have the book "The Thompson submachine gun" by Martin Pegler but this one didn't answer all my questions unfortunately. For my de-activated Thompson I paid roughly $500,- , is this a fair price? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrylta Posted November 17, 2011 Report Share Posted November 17, 2011 A good place to order it from is machinegunbooks.comI guess price is relative to your circumstances:-) The book is authored by Frank Iannamicoand titled American Thunder Part II Again stay safe & legal,Darryl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stgw. 57 Posted November 17, 2011 Report Share Posted November 17, 2011 (edited) .................For my de-activated Thompson I paid roughly $500,- , is this a fair price? That seems not too bad, I know that in Germany they go for about 300€, I think in Italy they are more expensive......we don't have a market for deactivated guns where I live....so I'm not really up to date. EDIT: Sorry I was wrong on the german prices....more like 500€ + http://www.zib-milit...fen%22/Allierte Edited November 17, 2011 by Stgw. 57 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcel Banziger Posted November 18, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 18, 2011 Thanks for the info!! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casper Posted November 21, 2011 Report Share Posted November 21, 2011 +1 for 450-500 euro for a nice M1 dewat , nice orignals, working condition are going for maximum 1200 euro, Euuuh no, didn't forget that extra 0+1 that we can own 100% functional machineguns over here too 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thomasD Posted December 7, 2011 Report Share Posted December 7, 2011 This is an Austrian Dealer of deactivated guns: http://www.dekowaffen-tuerk.com/viewpage.php?page_id=1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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