Dillinger's Prayer

[OCM]

Dillinger's bedtime prayer....

[ghostsoldier]

Well, Sandy....he sort of got his wish.

Rob

[darrylta]

More like stalked and sucker shot,,,never knew what happened.

-Darryl

[OCM]

More like stalked and sucker shot,,,never knew what happened.

-Darryl

Oh, I think he knew for a couple seconds, taking off running, couple 38s going right through his chest, no vital organs hit, a quick " oh shit, I've been shot " then boom back of the neck and down he goes. From there ???? He was alive just till they got him to the Alexian Bros Hospitol where he died. Body was set in the front lawn, then moved to the Cook County Morgue. I got a photo somewhere of the cops standing around the police ambulance in the front lawn, while JD's body was laying there. Must to be some confusion as who was going to take him to the CC Morgue ?

 

Yes, stalked and sucker shot- That's how it was done in the old days, saved the people a lot of tax $$$$.

 

OCM

[ghostsoldier]

Yeah...any way it took...they were gonna get their man.

Rob

[OCM]

More like stalked and sucker shot,,,never knew what happened.

-Darryl

 

Been meaning to ask, how many people know who your photo is ? I know and know where it came from. Good job. I had the opportunity to talk to his son years ago, gone now. ( Jr. that is )

 

OCM

[darrylta]

A no nonsense, non political Texas Ranger that was involved in the Bonnie & Clyde ambush

and other one riot--one ranger actions ------Capt. Frank Hamer

 

I bet it was eye opening experience meeting with Jr.,,,From what I've read, Frank was a very principled

individual, to his own detriment at times.

-Darryl

[jim c 351]

Gee Wiz, to think that I thought the above 3 pictures were of the actual poster. Thats what I do.

Jim C

[OCM]

A no nonsense, non political Texas Ranger that was involved in the Bonnie & Clyde ambush

and other one riot--one ranger actions ------Capt. Frank Hamer

 

I bet it was eye opening experience meeting with Jr.,,,From what I've read, Frank was a very principled

individual, to his own detriment at times.

-Darryl

 

Never met him face to face tho, I think it's his son now that's in the outlaw group we have online. I've emailed him couple times.

Frank Sr did his job well. Lot of tall tales about what he did at the ambush, Jeff Guinn's book is pretty accurate, other then he didn't blast Bonnie in the face.

Boots Hinton I've met 3-4 times , he runs the B&C museum in Gibsland still. His partner died recently, nice guy.

Marie Barrow, who I knew very well, has stories that would make your hair stand on end. Real , true, 1930s outlaw stuff ! Scary.

[OCM]

A no nonsense, non political Texas Ranger that was involved in the Bonnie & Clyde ambush

and other one riot--one ranger actions ------Capt. Frank Hamer

 

I bet it was eye opening experience meeting with Jr.,,,From what I've read, Frank was a very principled

individual, to his own detriment at times.

-Darryl

 

Never met him face to face tho, I think it's his son now that's in the outlaw group we have online. I've emailed him couple times.

Frank Sr did his job well. Lot of tall tales about what he did at the ambush, Jeff Guinn's book is pretty accurate, other then he didn't blast Bonnie in the face.

Boots Hinton I've met 3-4 times , he runs the B&C museum in Gibsland still. His partner died recently, nice guy.

Marie Barrow, who I knew very well, has stories that would make your hair stand on end. Real , true, 1930s outlaw stuff ! Scary.

 

Harrison Hamer, that's who I was thinking of , he's still around too. I think he wrote a book, been to long ago.

[darrylta]

I'll have to look the book up, interesting reading I'm sure.

I've read several versions of the ambush, do you know if the BAR

used by Hamer's troops was a M1918 or Hamer's monitor?

 

Jim,

As far as the photos, it's as close as I'll ever get to re-enacting I guess

-Darryl

[OCM]

I'll have to look the book up, interesting reading I'm sure.

I've read several versions of the ambush, do you know if the BAR

used by Hamer's troops was a M1918 or Hamer's monitor?

 

Jim,

As far as the photos, it's as close as I'll ever get to re-enacting I guess

-Darryl

 

Another fellow and I did a fairly intense study of the ambush, site measurements, timings, used an identical car too. I also was invited to Whiskey Pete's Casino at the time, to do a personal study of the death car, spent about an hour and a half with it taking pictures to document a full clone of the car.

Our findings were published in a couple publications.

Of course this caused some riffs in the Bonnie & Clyde camps as normal and expected. Right or wrong, we did the most intense investigation at the time.

From what we gleaned, Hamer started at the passenger side rear then around to the passenger side firing a Colt Monitor. Results show entry holes coming downward into the passenger side roof and one entry into Bonnie's right cheek, exiting the other side. I had photo documentation of this, but some die-hard Bonnie & Clyde followers, couldn't see or except this. They tend to get a little excentric, as we all do I guess.

Anyway, Jeff Guinn's book is a good history of the Bonnie & Clyde era, but a long read. Jim Knight's book a bit easier to read. Both excellent-

Colt Monitor, yes, just like yours.

Sandy

Edited March 10, 2013 by OCM

[jim c 351]

OCM,

So you are sayiing that 2 Brownings were used?? I thought Hamer used a Remington M8 and only Hinton used a Browning..

Jim C

[darrylta]

Wow Sandy, that blows away all the other authors facts I've read.

I can see why your analysis ruffled some feathers.

 

I have to tip my hat to your version knowing how diligent you are

and the people you have interviewed over the years.

Thanks for the info,,

-Darryl

[OCM]

OCM,

So you are sayiing that 2 Brownings were used?? I thought Hamer used a Remington M8 and only Hinton used a Browning..

Jim C

 

We have Hamer with a Model 11, Hinton with a Browning Automatic Rifle.

[OCM]

Wow Sandy, that blows away all the other authors facts I've read.

I can see why your analysis ruffled some feathers.

 

I have to tip my hat to your version knowing how diligent you are

and the people you have interviewed over the years.

Thanks for the info,,

-Darryl

 

One of the biggest mysteries out there- Many versions of the ambush, don't know why. We based everything , on counting holes, size, who stood where and a very intense study of the car. I think Jim Knight now has a bit on an updated version, we've discussed that, he's a good friend of mine. BUT we still disagree on some of the weapons.

 

Do know Oakley had a Remington Model 8 , I've talked with the owner ( prior owner ) This is where the confusion is, between Oakley and Hamer, were there a shotgun used besides the BARs???? gets confusing and I've spent enough time and theory on that subject that I just tell the B&C geeks to get a time machine Haaaaa.

Hamer had a Model 11 shotgun, Colt Monitor and possibly fired from a 45 cal side arm, he was last in line. If you even gave Barrow the slightest chance, some officer was going to get killed. Hamer made sure the insanity was stopped.

As you know his Monitor is/was on display at the Waco Texas Ranger's Museum, saying it was one of the guns that was used at the ambush of B&C.

Even THIS is disputed by the B&C followers ?

 

Enough of this, old news-

[darrylta]

Didn't mean to bring back bygone arguments. I've had similar disagreements at the Colt Forum

on this subject as well. I guess it's better to let sleeping dogs lie.

 

Yet, I do appreciate your efforts on the subject and in keeping history alive for the rest of us.

 

Thanks,

Darryl

Edited August 29, 2012 by darrylta

[OCM]

Didn't mean to bring back bygone arguments. I've had similar disagreements at the Colt Forum

on this subject as well. I guess it's better to let sleeping dogs lie.

 

Yet, I do appreciate your efforts on the subject and in keeping history alive for the rest of us.

 

Thanks,

Darryl

 

 

No problem Darryl, I'm to old to debate these things anymore, Clyde & Bonnie, John Dillinger and the rest. There's a group of 5 of us maybe, that have done a lot of research on the history of the 30s outlaws, I mean a lot of research. Not necessarily together, but on our own, we know each other of course. Always more then happy to share my research, but I don't defend it anymore.

I've forgotten a lot too, unless it's published somewhere and I can look it up as anyone else can. I had a fairly large research library that is now with the Washington DC Museum, my files are here but a mess-

My answer a lot of times now is I don't know I wasn't there, and a lot of that is true anyway.

I just mess with my cars & guns these days, stay off the outlaw forums.

More then happy to help answer anything you guys ask, just tell you what I remember ( ouch )

 

Sandy

[ghostsoldier]

Where just proud to have your knowledge and expertise with us here on this board, Sandy.

Rob

[OCM]

Where just proud to have your knowledge and expertise with us here on this board, Sandy.

Rob

 

Thanks Rob-

My pleasure, glad we can all share some of this stuff. Sometimes it's easy to get caught up in the stuff, the romance of it and all, the bank robberies with a 1933 Buick, Thompson under arm, free money and speeding away with a beautiful moll at your side, real Johnny Deppish stuff.

Knowing a lot of the family members has given me a pretty good insight to who & what these 1930s guys & gals were like.

In general, a pretty much dysfunctional lot. A lot of good people died because of them.

Right or wrong, it is our American history and I find it very interesting. They crammed a lot in a short time.

 

In Bill Helmer's book, Dillinger the Untold Story, he opens up with an interesting quote from the bible :

 

" And he will be a wild man, his hand will be against every man, and every man's hand against him. Genesis, xvi, 12 "

 

Pretty much sums up Mr. D's life- a 14 month career.