How does the trigger in an ANM2 .30 work?

[bigbore]

As in how does it release the sear? I have this back plate, but having never seen the complete gun I'm lost. Is this a functional trigger or just a filler piece in this back plate? I have both of Iannamico's Browning books and they don't mention anything about the ANM2 .30 trigger.

Thanks.

[Black River Militaria CII]

The butterfly trigger is missing. The "tongue" of the butterfly trigger should extend about 3/4" past the opening but, as there is a stub visible in the opening, it has been cut off. The stub seems to be attached to a pivot bar with the correct crosspin through it, but there is no thumb butterfly attached above the pivot bar. You will need to replace the butterfly or replicate it with an appropriate tongue to actuate the sear release bar. FWIW

[Black River Militaria CII]

This was a duplicate post and now it is removed.......

Edited June 7, 2020 by Black River Militaria CII

[bigbore]

The butterfly trigger is missing. The "tongue" of the butterfly trigger should extend about 3/4" past the opening but, as there is a stub visible in the opening, it has been cut off. The stub seems to be attached to a pivot bar with the correct crosspin through it, but there is no thumb butterfly attached above the pivot bar. You will need to replace the butterfly or replicate it with an appropriate tongue to actuate the sear release bar. FWIW

 

The 'tongue" missing makes sense as a missing link. I'm going to make a new trigger for a Stinger build. While the gun is in the transfer process I bought spare parts to start the build. I was hoping this assembly had the "tongue" so I could get measurements to make a trigger.

Thanks for the info!

[jl7422]

Please keep us posted on the progress of your Stinger build.

[bigbore]

Please keep us posted on the progress of your Stinger build.

 

Will Do! The examples I've seen online are more Hollywood than Han Solo's blaster. I'm making this with WWII parts on WWII age/correct machines.

Edited June 8, 2020 by bigbore

[jl7422]

I've seen different descriptions of what parts were used on the originals, and from what guns (and aircraft) they were sourced. There seems to be some disagreement on various components. Being as they were assembled outside of normal channels, I can understand that. Anyway, I'll be interested to follow your progress.

[bigbore]

I've seen different descriptions of what parts were used on the originals, and from what guns (and aircraft) they were sourced. There seems to be some disagreement on various components. Being as they were assembled outside of normal channels, I can understand that. Anyway, I'll be interested to follow your progress.

 

There are no documents, and there are no pictures. People can debate how they were built, but there is no debate when people use parts that didn't exist at the time.

[emmagee1917]

Crap , you should have contacted me . There are manual backplates ( gripped ) and fixed , wing gun backplates ( no butterfly grip ) . You have the first , you need the second . See plate 2 vs. plate 3 . The manual trigger fits where the little teardrop tab sticks back out of the bottom of 3 .

http://www.biggerhammer.net/anm2/opmanual/

 

Chris

[emmagee1917]

Also , in answer to your first question , on the 1919A4 you pull UP on the trigger to sew-saw the front DOWN to pull the sear DOWN from the firing pin , releasing the firing pin . As the bolt moves back the sear disconnects from the trigger nose and is sucked up by the sear spring where it recatches the firing pin when it is camed back . As the bolt goes forward ( and if the trigger is still raised ) the trigger nose and the sear mesh and the sear is pulled down again , releasing the firing pin again .

In the ANM2 , the rear is pulled up , dropping the front nose down as on the A4 , The front nose then pushes the rear of a see-saw bar ( called the trigger bar ) down , raising it's nose . That nose then contacts the sear holder pushing the release up a ramp causing it to slide to the side , causing the firing pin to be released .

 

Oh , and pictures of the stinger are around . Note that six were made but never was it said they were all the same . Going by pictures , though , the following can be said . 1 ) rear sight is a shortened M2HB rear sight with the mounting holes drilled to fit the ANM2 top plate ( NOT a BAR rear sight ) . 2) The Bipod was made from BAR bipod with the barrel mount sliced in half and welded to the plate . 3) the plate that held the bipod / carry handle / ammo can was hand cut / welded together . 4) The carry handle proper is the ANM2 flexible grip 5) ammo can was an aircraft 100 round box ( prob'ly a PBY waist type ) . 6) They used 100 round cloth tank belts , but could use the 250 if needed , just harder to carry ( the picture with the 250 was , I believe , just added to make the picture " complete" ) The front sight is a standard 1919A4 front with the mounting bolt lug ground off . It was welded in the large hole in the receiver front , just clearing the barrel .

 

Hope this helps you , Chris

[bigbore]

1 ) rear sight is a shortened M2HB rear sight with the mounting holes drilled to fit the ANM2 top plate ( NOT a BAR rear sight ) .

2) The Bipod was made from BAR bipod with the barrel mount sliced in half and welded to the plate .

3) the plate that held the bipod / carry handle / ammo can was hand cut / welded together . 4) The carry handle proper is the ANM2 flexible grip 5) ammo can was an aircraft 100 round box ( prob'ly a PBY waist type ) .

6) They used 100 round cloth tank belts , but could use the 250 if needed , just harder to carry ( the picture with the 250 was , I believe , just added to make the picture " complete" ) The front sight is a standard 1919A4 front with the mounting bolt lug ground off . It was welded in the large hole in the receiver front , just clearing the barrel .

 

 

Hope this helps you , Chris

 

Sources?

[emmagee1917]

Years of studying the few pictures out there , written reports of the men who made / carried them , a couple years slowly building two of them up and then comparing the angle view with the pictures , tearing them apart and retrying until they match , then building a single shot receiver to verify sight alignment , trigger pull , and general fit and function until one of several builders came out with semi-auto side plates ( none ever did as of yet ) . It was a labor of love , for no one could afford to pay me for the time and effort I put into them . I then documented everything and posted pictures of all that I did . Photobucket then stole and deleted all my pictures and files after I had sold the two conversion kits I had built to pay my wife's mounting medical bills . Lucky13 over on 1919A4.com is working on a semi-auto set up now , but that site was recently bought by an outside presence and has completely screwed the site up to a point where I can't fly it . I do miss it so .

Chris

[bigbore]

Where can I find copies of the written reports? Can you post the pictures you studied?

Unless I can find anything that anyone can prove, I'm going to build mine based mostly on what was available and what seems practical. I did get a chuckle out of you saying a 1919 front sight was used. I have never seen that referenced before, but I had already decided that is exactly how I'm going to do it. I've been looking into this for years as well.

As I said, I dont know how, and no one can prove anything beyond their own theory, but in the process I've learned a lot about how they didnt do it. Most annoying is the 1919A6 carry handle, and who the hell would mount anything to the left side of a barrel shroud that is attached with right hand threads?

My stinger project will be mostly finished by this weekend I hope. So far the only road block is cutting down and reassembling a shortened ammo can.

Thanks for the insight.

[emmagee1917]

https://www.guns.com/news/2012/08/15/stinger-light-machinegun

 

Most of that is gone due to computer crashes and Photobucket . Most pictures are other people's replicas , not the real deal , Note the pictures in the above link . The 250-ish round box I think was added for the photo op , but as I said , no guarantee all were the same . The only reference was a written report by one of the users which stated they used 100 rd tank cloth belts in small boxes for better balance . Note the carry handle - it is NOT an A6 . Note the rear sight - what's the only common rear sight in use by the USMC / navy with the knob on that side and not the other ? Did you know that the 50BMG elevation clicks vs range marks pretty much duplicates the A4 ? If you place the front sight I specified as I said , the elevation is right on . Note the bipod . WW2 BAR , not post war . Note how the mounting plate uses the receiver holes that mount the gun in the wing or flexible mount . These were made in Hawaii at a Naval ship yard and they had access to the scrap yards . Everything I noted was available and matches every reliable reference I could find and these two original pictures .

Chris

[bigbore]

I've seen those pics. The BAR bipod legs and welded directly to the barrel shroud, and had to be bent out to compensate for the steep attachment angle.

[emmagee1917]

As an aside , the final picture is the pre-production version of the stinger . It was built aboard ship at Bougainville out of flexible mounted ANM2 ( note grips ) with a BAR bipod mounted on the barrel shroud directly ( note the legs have not been altered / bent ) .

In use , the fire team would advance and hit the ground with the gunner square behind the gun and would hose the forest ahead , towards the incoming fire , with a 250 round burst .

Chris

[StrangeRanger]

There are Stinger videos on youtube but for some reason, the links are not posting

Edited June 9, 2020 by StrangeRanger

[emmagee1917]

I've seen those pics. The BAR bipod legs and welded directly to the barrel shroud, and had to be bent out to compensate for the steep attachment angle.

 

Except the legs are aft of the rear of the shroud . And there looks to be " something " around the top of the legs . They could have welded it directly to the front of the reciever , but with a carrying handle to attach ( and it has to be offset to allow the top cover to open - one of my trail and errors ) and the ammo box as well , I just figured they made up a mounting plate . Of course THIS is just my figuring they'd not want to weld directly to a functioning receiver I never had a close up view of this , but my plate assembly matched what I could see .

Chris

[bigbore]

There are Stinger videos on youtube but for some reason, the links are not posting

 

The gun featured in those videos is a Hollywood joke as cheesy as Han Solo's blaster in Star Wars, IMO.

[emmagee1917]

There are Stinger videos on youtube but for some reason, the links are not posting

 

Yes , many of them . But most use modern copies made long after WW2 and they are not close to original . There are only a few pictures of the real thing known , the ones I posted being the most common . I did have a couple more but I only came upon them by luck after a lot of work , and I don't want to spend days / weeks / months on this project again . I am willing to help those that I can , however .

Chris

[bigbore]

 

I've seen those pics. The BAR bipod legs and welded directly to the barrel shroud, and had to be bent out to compensate for the steep attachment angle.

 

Except the legs are aft of the rear of the shroud . And there looks to be " something " around the top of the legs . They could have welded it directly to the front of the reciever , but with a carrying handle to attach ( and it has to be offset to allow the top cover to open - one of my trail and errors ) and the ammo box as well , I just figured they made up a mounting plate . Of course THIS is just my figuring they'd not want to weld directly to a functioning receiver I never had a close up view of this , but my plate assembly matched what I could see .

Chris

 

I think the goop around the legs is excess weld material from someone gas welding that didnt care about appearance.

[StrangeRanger]

 

There are Stinger videos on youtube but for some reason, the links are not posting

 

The gun featured in those videos is a Hollywood joke as cheesy as Han Solo's blaster in Star Wars, IMO.

 

The Forgotten Weapons video is pretty informative, some of the others not so much

[BPinFL]

I built my Stinger with a Beretta 38/ buttstock, Bren carry handle and bipod which is bolted to the front tripod mounting holes. Made the trigger bar. All parts are WWII vintage.

It's quite a handful to shoot. On the bench I nail the bipod legs down. from the hip I limit it to 6-7 round bursts,which is the least I can do. BP

[bigbore]

Not pretty(neither were originals), but it works well.