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Ot: Alot Of Mg's For Sale By Dealers?

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Thank You for your opinions and for the wealth of information on Colt BARs.

I've been lurking and looking around for Colt BARs and this Monitor is the first I've seen for sale.

The problem I'm having is determining the selling price after a piece has sold.

I watched a 1919 Colt Commercial sell for $30K a year ago at Arms-Ordnance.com which I passed on because I really wanted a 1918 military BAR instead. And I would want to shoot the 1918 BAR, but probably not the 1919 BAR.

I've even flown out to look at some $25K-$28K BARs that were not as advertised re: condition and properly dated and correct parts for a 1918 BAR of that price. Some were even rusted out in the gas cylinder with Korean era parts.

And every few months or so the price goes up again. Now the going price for a 1918 is around $35K and if your figures are correct on the 1919 then $30K a year ago would have been a very good deal?

Now The Colt Monitor is a whole different Deal altogether. I just can't believe that there is one for sale, $85K or not.


Thanks for your Help,



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Guys, people that buy a Monitor are the same folks that belly up to the bar and whip it out to see who's is biggest. There are bragging rights at stake you know.


Now, with that said, the truth be known, most of us have stretched a budget to pick up a piece or two. Mine was on the post-war transferrable MG-42 built in '64. I got in it at a decent price (not a steal), and hope that one day it's worth a mint. Only about 6 in the registry. I would like to think it's worth about the same as the Monitor, but who knows. No one has offered that, but I haven't put it on the market either.


All of us have fantasies about the value of our collections rocketing out of sight. After seeing the stumbling prices this summer, I wonder.


My late night ramble for the day.





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I agree that there are bragging rights associated with the ownership of a Colt Monitor, and at $85K it is probably out of reach for most of us anyway. Too much Risk involved for the Return/Bragging Rights.

But there are some bragging rights with almost all NFA items and even some nonNFA. Just go to a Gun Range.

Also which do you think is a better investment/collectable a $18K-$20K Group Industries BAR, a $25K-$28K RIA M60 or a genuine $30K-$35K 1918 BAR?

I guess what I'm trying to say is people are paying close to the same price for some aftermarket items as they would for a Real Deal Historical item.

The Colt Monitor is an incredible piece of U.S. Firearms History and Law Enforcement History.

Also How many Monitors Have come up for sale?

For me it is just amazing to see a Monitor come up for sale out of someone's collection.


That is all,



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ed at urban armory is a nice guy.but he's a gun broker.doe's not own what he sell's and alot of time's has not seen the gun just pic's and somebody describe's it...as i said.this might not be the case on this one.hal spiro owned a r75.he is now deceased...he had alot of nice class three stuff at one time...


heck buy it whoever,and shoot the heck out of it...since it supposed to be worth more in future.a few thousands rounds won't hurt it right?? wink!!


not many shooting that stuff you know.........thats like all the classic car's not many driven anymore.they just sit in the garage under a tarp/or cover..


i knew a well to do guy back in il. went to his place.had a few million dollar car collection..back in 1995. he drove a testa -rossa.{red head}


the rest just got worked on... and waxed he now drive's with neuman........... when it came to gun's he always said just for fun.......but hopefully i won't lose my shirt.... on his car's his passion...he did not care too much..he always said thats the cost of driving them....


he's the only guy i ever knew who went to bloomington gold.with a tractor trailer and driver...to buy 8 or so vette's at a time...whatever tripped his trigger..


so i guess he had a few bean's to spend at the time...


it was never less then $300,000.00


so to him the colt monitor is a doable shooter...to the other 98% of us. a dream...


so whoever wants to write the check for $85,000.00 step to it...before this guy find's out about it.wink! take care,ron

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Thanks for the responses to my questions.


Alas I must admit the Colt Monitor is just a dream, but it is still nice to see some of these items come up for sale.

Plus I'd probably want to shoot the darn thing way more than it should be shot.


Your Car Collector friend sounds like a good guy to know.

I hope he finds the car he's always wanted. At $300K a pop He must at least have fun trying.




Thanks Again,



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I agree. For most of us, we get the thrill out of going to the range with this stuff to show it off. Me included.


Shooting the Monitor would be like my MG-42. I worry about it when I go to the range. I do it occasionally, and have replaced a bunch of the parts on it to avoid excessive wear on them. Unfortunately, unlikely that you can do that. Just don't put Indian ammo through it :-)


If your dream is a highly collectible piece, the Monitor sure fits the bill. Do it by all means if you can.


On cars, I started restoring a 63 Vette, aka the money vaccum. Eats more money than horses. Screwed by three guys who were going to complete the car but never did. Found MG's lost interest, car is about 50% restored and up for sale. A money looser for sure.


Only worries on MG's are is the bureaucrats in DC and what they could do to us.


My post was not a knock of your dream, if it came across that way, I apologize sincerely. DO IT!!!



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No problem here.


I completely agree with your overall assessment, and I did not mean to imply that I took offense to your post.

I was just trying to put some of the NFA collecting trends that I have been observing into perspective. Especially

with the high prices being paid for aftermarket items when the Real Deal items are not that far off in price.

That is the only point I was trying to make in response to your previous post.


I also think that owning and shooting an MG-42 would be a Dream come true. That MG is one of the most sought after MGs out there. Presently I have a friend who is waiting for his paperwork to process on an MG42. He actually sold some of his collection to obtain the MG42, that is how much he wanted it.


I doubt that I will obtain the Monitor, but it is still exciting to actually see one come up for sale.




Thanks ,



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Thanks for the offer re: your MG42, but right now I'm really looking for another BAR.

I'll keep it in mind though. May I tell a friend about the AF 1944 Mauser C&R MG42?


BTW I think the Monitor would be a nice addition to your collection. http://www.machinegunbooks.com/forums/invboard1_1_2/upload/html/emoticons/wink.gif





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the monitor will probably sell,however not for that asking price...i could actually swing it...and that would be the only thing {gun} i could own...then have to move to a van on the river....wink! would not be worth that.........it would have to be the one swung by mr.chase in the battle with the fed's and baby face nelson{lester gillis}to be worth that kind of change..with history backing it up.


however if it doe's sell for that.....then i know of a nice 1921a with a ton of history..that should bring $170,000.00................t.g.and all!


i will dream,and do my house deal!and play with the cheap stuff...it's supposed to be fun, take care,ron

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Hi Ron,


Soon we'll all be living down by the river next to you in vans and tents. http://www.machinegunbooks.com/forums/invboard1_1_2/upload/html/emoticons/laugh.gif


Maybe we'll all be rich with the windfall from our NFA collections? http://www.machinegunbooks.com/forums/invboard1_1_2/upload/html/emoticons/wink.gif

Who Knows?

I hope the $170K 1921A sells soon. http://www.machinegunbooks.com/forums/invboard1_1_2/upload/html/emoticons/cool.gif

So you can take a break from it all.


I agree it is supposed to be fun. That is why I got out of the Stock Market Game.

At least it has been fun talking/writing about it.


All the Best,



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the good old day's is when you could go out and buy ten nice colt's for $50,000.00 a nice 1918 bar for $5,000.00, and a colt 1919 commercial bar for $6,500.00. and even get some nice belt fed's for under $5,000.00>


sure everything else has risen, but not as much as the crazy class three stuff.


and you have to wonder...who live's in a couple hundred thou house today...and the gun's in the safe are worth more..something is wrong there.......


or the guy sitting in the million $$ crib...and sitting on a mill worth of stuff...


i guess i'm from the old school of stupid economic's...

house value>$500,000.00 gun's $100,000.00 car $25,000.00


not trailer or house value>$50,000.00 car $45,000.00 and gun's $200,000.00


but then again i have always done thing's a little different. must have been too many "combat episode's"at a early age.


or at the age of ten running in the back alley's squirting young girl's....... with the plastic tommy!! wink!


and yelling get down incoming!!


take care,ron

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I think you guys are being a little paranoid here....

The dealers you all are looking at are known for the collections they come across, broker and/or sell.

Collections tend to come up for sale in fits and starts. This has been going on for quite some time. Old collector dies and his widow sells the collection. Since most of the guys on this board are watching Thompsons you don't see all the other collections that have gone by in the last few years. In the last 6 or 7 years I'd seen one PPD40 then blammo in the last year I've seen 8 more. Is this a glut of PPD's or a sudden sale because of the economy??? I don't think so. I think we have just hit a couple collections that have a lot of Thompsons in them. A lot of the other theorys sound feasible too so don't take this as a flame...just my opinion.


Jonny 45- the M249 that was advertised at $47K is indeed a pre-86 gun. I've heard of and seen transferable M240-MAG58's but I don't think there are any real transferable 249's. The pre-86 guns come up pretty frequently as there are quite a few around. Prices started at around $75 K a couple years back but seem to have stabilized around the $50K mark.





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i really think the best one's are,the one's that advertise at really high dollar...they get no response in a few days.{the world of the net they need instant satisfaction}


and they drop the price like a bomb.gun is at $12,000.00


all of a sudden they want $9,999.00


why they didn't advertise at the real deal selling price in the beginning,maybe a little over the cost of it.


or the ad that read's,they had this forever now selling. then you find out they did a trade months ago for it.


a bold face b.s.story...or they make up some history on the item to sell it for higher..


i guess now it's all the hype and t.g.out there to sell! sell! sell!


and when people talk about collector's..for the most part all gone...now it's dealer/collector /trader/ name tag:


if they can make a quick kill buck fast..it's sold... at least they should admit that...and cut out the collector honory name tag:


the market has changed big time in ten year's...have i changed?sure. more grey,less time for work, more for play.


do i hope someday to see it all come back.never happen.


"one thing in life that always remain's the same is change"


do some get the point out there..never happen... however by the end of this year and maybe the next...price's will not get as crazy...as people somehow smarten up. and ask them self. do i really need that at that price..


like the barrett/jackson car auction's...hype sale's,hype car's.hype price's...and they advertise it for the normal guy...wink! what are they smokin "cheech and chong"


so as we all go back to daily life.keep a straight head.stay safe be prepared.

and stay the course.never pay too much!!


and if you go without...don't worry life's too short anyhow...


and as the dust settle's on the tombstone's.

devine has new stuff to peddle.


take care,ron

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Now there's a way to drive up MG prices. A televised MG auction by Barrett-Jackson.


Don't anyone suggest this to Devine, next thing you know, Deveine would be tacking on a fee based upon the numbers of viewing public. :-)



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i can see it now black suited shade wearing hawker's.. shaking the hands of beer gutted, flower shirted baggy pant's wearing shower shoe fitted az.buyer's..


oh and the straw hat... and some newly transplanted cali. buyer's...with mo -money then brain cell's...buying that part of american history...


do i hear $85,000.00 for this slighty pitted redone colt..unmatched wood with bulged barrel??


oh wait we have a blowhard in the audience...he will pay $100,000.00 herman give that man another mike's hard lemonade... "don't let him sober up"keep up the bid's...


we have a drum magazine holds 39 rounds rare.only made a few thousand.{who wanted them then??} bid starts at $16,000.00


and people in the audience are impressed with the selling and buying frenzy....and wanting to shake hands with the buyer's...


what is it with the human condition...that you'd want to shake hands with some a-hole who just paid too much for something that everybody involved in the hype put' s a percieved artificial value on for a fashion show...be it car's or gun's??


is it to say good boy?? you did well..buy another! or wish we looked like the bloated unshaven a-hole in the hooter's shirt.with the tattooed lady with him..


or a dream of we could have owned it...if we just had mo-money and less sense.


we could be that shakin hands with everybody in the crowd a-hole...yep!!


well let the fun begin..........i just want to be the ticket taker..for the 20,000 sheeple who show up..and make a buck on each...


so i can buy that shirt.the baggy pant's,the shades and panama hat.and the sandal's or shower shoe's.. and say i'm one of "the guy's" wink!!


how far some have fallen..get the net. double.wink!


remember have fun,stay sane.take care,ron

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Barrett-Jackson has perfected the art of superficially raising the bids on supposed legitimate classic vehicle auctions. He actually allowed the owner of a vintage automobile to bid on his own car that was up for auction.

The owner was only interested in the publicity of an overblown recorded bidding figure that he himself created.


Ever since "Speed-Vision" (now just "Speed Channel") decided to carry Jackson's Scottsdale auction live for three days, the PT Barnum of the collector car market couldn't resist the implications of coast to coast fraud.

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