Phillies Posted September 3, 2011 Report Share Posted September 3, 2011 I have a M1 Thompson parts kit that I want to make into a display rifle. I live in a non NFA state so I can't buy a real Thompson. I was debating between getting a Philly Ordnance 80% receiver with all the matching markings on it or getting a saw cut thompson receiver. The Philly Ordnance receiver would look alot nicer but a demilled receiver would be more authenic. I also don't want a cheap aluminum dummy receiver as I want my display rifle to have the same weight as the real thing. Thanks. And I've been waiting 2 weeks to ask this question here but it took that long to get my registraion approved by a moderator Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalbert Posted September 3, 2011 Report Share Posted September 3, 2011 Thanks. And I've been waiting 2 weeks to ask this question here but it took that long to get my registraion approved by a moderator Phillies, Welcome to the board! I apologize for it taking so long to approve your membership. I get over 300 membership requests per day, and 99%+ are from spammers. Without the spammers, membership could be instantaneous. Sometimes I let certain requests, such as yours, age a bit, so I can tell if an internet spamming history develops with the same IP address and identity. (The more obvious and unique profile names sometimes don't have to wait as long, because I can tell they're not spammers, but "Phillies" was generic enough that it did not instill my confidence...) I also have been extremely busy lately, and at this moment have 3,542 membership requests in the queue awaiting approval. If anyone else sees this, if you are waiting to be approved for membership, please send me an e-mail that lets me know you are a legitimately interested person for this board, and I'll approve it. Thanks! David Albert dalbert@sturmgewehr.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gio Posted September 3, 2011 Report Share Posted September 3, 2011 Hi and welcome to the board. Just my two cents I went with phil ordance reciever on my dummy Thompson and it looks great. Bob will do you a great job and will mark it anyway you want. His price is reasonable and will get it to you in a timely manner. Plus you don't have to pay a arm and let for a cut reciever that may or may not be legal. Good luck Frank Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phillies Posted September 3, 2011 Author Report Share Posted September 3, 2011 Thanks. As far as those saw cut Thompson receivers go... I sometimes see them on gunbroker and they usually go for a premium. Not counting the price factor, but would there be any issues putting a saw cut receiver on my parts kits to make a display rifle? I read some posts on message boards where people say to run away from them, but if they were illegal, then why would you see so many of them up for sale on gunbroker? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james m Posted September 14, 2011 Report Share Posted September 14, 2011 (edited) Thanks. As far as those saw cut Thompson receivers go... I sometimes see them on gunbroker and they usually go for a premium. Not counting the price factor, but would there be any issues putting a saw cut receiver on my parts kits to make a display rifle? I read some posts on message boards where people say to run away from them, but if they were illegal, then why would you see so many of them up for sale on gunbroker? I agree with the above post. I had Bob(Philadelphia Ordnance) built a receiver for my 1928 parts kit and someone literally has to pick it up and inspect the gun to tell it just a display piece. Even if you can figure out some way to legally tack weld a torched original receiver back for display it will be obvious that this was done from 10 feet away. Jim Edited September 14, 2011 by james m Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD. Posted September 15, 2011 Report Share Posted September 15, 2011 Phillies, Welcome to the Board. We get a lot of questions on the Board about using demil and/or saw cut receivers for dummy or display guns. The answer is simple - there is no upside to doing this. Each assembly would be judged on its own merits. You don't want to be on the losing side of any government decision. The smarter approach is to use one of Bob's display receivers. You will sleep much better at night. And have a much better looking display. Don't worry about why this demil stuff is out there and what can be done with it. None of the answers are 100% guaranteed when you start putting it back together again without the proper ATF license. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emmagee1917 Posted September 15, 2011 Report Share Posted September 15, 2011 In a nut shell , if you have a properly torch cut reciever on your shelf and no other parts , it is clear you have it just to have it. When you add a parts kit to the mix , the reason for having it becomes less clear cut. When you start attaching the reciever pieces back together , well then it is even less clear and they will look at it as a possible attempt at an illegal build and , indeed , it is easy to undo thier requirements . Remember , a gun does not have to go bang for them to get you , intent ( thier interpretation of yours ) counts as well. Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phillies Posted September 15, 2011 Author Report Share Posted September 15, 2011 Thanks. A Philly Ordnance receiver might be the way to go then. Have to figure out if I need to get one that is blued or parkerized. I almost pulled the trigger on a few gunbroker auctions of demilled saw cut receivers but didn't feel to comfortable. I almot bought this one display Thompson that had a saw cut receiver with the bolt welded into the receiver to form a of metal. Is that legal I don't know but I passed on it for better or worse. It sold for a buy it now price of $850 or $950 with an extra bolt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james m Posted September 15, 2011 Report Share Posted September 15, 2011 To the best of my knowledge, anytine you start welding a machine gun back together you're entering a grey area. Having said that; Don Bell(Omega Weapons) has had a welded up PPS 43 on his tables at gun shows for years and I think it's fair to say it's been seen by multiple BATF agents. According to him;He's never been confronted by them about it. Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phillies Posted September 17, 2011 Author Report Share Posted September 17, 2011 Thanks. As far as those saw cut Thompson receivers go... I sometimes see them on gunbroker and they usually go for a premium. Not counting the price factor, but would there be any issues putting a saw cut receiver on my parts kits to make a display rifle? I read some posts on message boards where people say to run away from them, but if they were illegal, then why would you see so many of them up for sale on gunbroker? I agree with the above post. I had Bob(Philadelphia Ordnance) built a receiver for my 1928 parts kit and someone literally has to pick it up and inspect the gun to tell it just a display piece. Even if you can figure out some way to legally tack weld a torched original receiver back for display it will be obvious that this was done from 10 feet away. Jim Thanks. That is a real nice looking display piece. Did that dummy bolt knob come with it or was that extra and how it that connected to the receiver? is the 80% receiver able to securely attach to the lower half? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sculptor Posted September 17, 2011 Report Share Posted September 17, 2011 I have built a couple if dummy Thompsons using Philly Ordnance receivers. A 1928A1 with the bolt open and a M1A1 with the bolt closed. In both cases I cut up original bolts to use in the dummy's. Both bolts were beat up junkers so I didn't destroy anything worth while. If you want to put a drum on the piece it is easier to have the bolt open unless you want. The Philly Ordnance receivers are beautifully made and lettered. You can't tell the guns are not real until you try to work the bolt. Here is a picture of them. Dick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james m Posted September 17, 2011 Report Share Posted September 17, 2011 The forward bolt piece in my display example has been flattened on the bottom so a drum goes right in. Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phillies Posted September 18, 2011 Author Report Share Posted September 18, 2011 I have built a couple if dummy Thompsons using Philly Ordnance receivers. A 1928A1 with the bolt open and a M1A1 with the bolt closed. In both cases I cut up original bolts to use in the dummy's. Both bolts were beat up junkers so I didn't destroy anything worth while. If you want to put a drum on the piece it is easier to have the bolt open unless you want. The Philly Ordnance receivers are beautifully made and lettered. You can't tell the guns are not real until you try to work the bolt. Here is a picture of them. Dick So you used part of a USGI bolt in the Philly Ordnance 80% receiver? Could you elaborate? Maybe I'm just a little confused. I did like your M1A1 display rifle in that pic! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sculptor Posted September 18, 2011 Report Share Posted September 18, 2011 (edited) I cut off the front of the bolt and the bolt handle from the '28 and the front of the M1. I set them into the Philly Ordnance receiver which was machined to accept them. I destroyed a '28 and a M1 bolt however, neither of the bolts were of any value and were laying around in a box of junk parts for years. Visually it is impossible to tell they are not 100% original Thompsons. Dick Edited September 18, 2011 by Sculptor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phillies Posted September 18, 2011 Author Report Share Posted September 18, 2011 I cut off the front of the bolt and the bolt handle from the '28 and the front of the M1. I set them into the Philly Ordnance receiver which was machined to accept them. I destroyed a '28 and a M1 bolt however, neither of the bolts were of any value and were laying around in a box of junk parts for years. Visually it is impossible to tell they are not 100% original Thompsons. Dick Interesting. I think I will have to try that. Although it'll be a shame to destroy the nice M1 Thompson bolt that came with my parts kit though. Unless I can see if I can buy a old junker bolt someplace... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rader Posted September 18, 2011 Report Share Posted September 18, 2011 I have built a couple if dummy Thompsons using Philly Ordnance receivers. A 1928A1 with the bolt open and a M1A1 with the bolt closed. In both cases I cut up original bolts to use in the dummy's. Both bolts were beat up junkers so I didn't destroy anything worth while. If you want to put a drum on the piece it is easier to have the bolt open unless you want. The Philly Ordnance receivers are beautifully made and lettered. You can't tell the guns are not real until you try to work the bolt. Here is a picture of them. Dick Sculptor, I am building a 28A1 like yours, can you put a picture of the top of your reeiver up so I can see how it is done. Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reconbob Posted September 19, 2011 Report Share Posted September 19, 2011 I now offer as an option a dummy bolt head. It is the round part of the bolt, machined for the extractor. You install the extractor just like an original bolt and fit the dummy bolt head in thru the front of the receiver before you screw the barrel on. The bolt head is long enough that a dummy actuator knob can be fitted thru it. If you use it on a M1928 you would want to machine off the bottom to be able to slide in a drum. (On real gun drum goes in with bolt cocked.) On the M1/M1A1 you don't need to do this. The dummy bolt head is $50. Bob/Phila Ord Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phillies Posted October 14, 2011 Author Report Share Posted October 14, 2011 Do the Philly Ordnance 80% receivers fit tightly on the lower or is there a loose fit to it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reconbob Posted October 15, 2011 Report Share Posted October 15, 2011 The fit is the same as original since we use the original drawings for dimensioning.The trigger frame should (and does) slide on easily, but it is not loose. If two parts areto slide together there must be clearance as opposed to a tight fit where they no longerhave the clearance to slide and must be assembled or disassembled with a mallet. Tightnesslike this would cause galling of the mating surfaces which would get worse over time. Bob/Phila Ord Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
videoguy Posted October 15, 2011 Report Share Posted October 15, 2011 I recently built four display guns. Be aware that when using the Philly receiver, there is a noticeable weight increase as the receiver is almost a solid block of steel. I would like to see some lightening holes milled into them. My receivers did not come blued so I sprayed them with a flat Dura-Coat, baked them, and the result was excellent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phillies Posted October 15, 2011 Author Report Share Posted October 15, 2011 I'm on the wait list for one right now. Bob said he will make some cuts in mine to make the weight close to what an actual Thompson would be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reconbob Posted October 16, 2011 Report Share Posted October 16, 2011 Phila ordnance receivers are used to make everything from dummy or display gunsup to finished shooting guns by Class 2 manufacturers. The basic receiver is, of courseheavy, but to address this we have for about a year now offered as an option on the80% receiver - a lightening cut which is 3/4" wide x 1" deep and runs the length of whatwould be the pocket for the bolt. This lightening cut gets the receiver very close to whatthe weight of a finished receiver with bolt installed would be. The extra cost of the lighteningcut is $25. It is interesting (at least to me) that few people order receivers with this option. Bob/Philly O 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rader Posted October 19, 2011 Report Share Posted October 19, 2011 Bob, I have 1 of your receiver,80%. Can you do the lightening cuts on it,if so, how much would it cost with S&h. Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reconbob Posted October 20, 2011 Report Share Posted October 20, 2011 The lightening cut is $25 if your receiver has the correct access hole forthe entry of this cutter. Depending on how old your receiver is this hole couldbe there and correct, or there and wrong size or wrong position, or not thereat all. If I have to drill and flat-bottom the entry hole by hand to be able to runit in the big machine it would be an extra $25 plus whatever return shipping is... Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kanemono Posted October 20, 2011 Report Share Posted October 20, 2011 I have two of Bob's receivers a 1928A1 and a M1A1. The 80% 1928A1 with a drum in place weighs the same as a 1928A1 with a fully loaded "L" Drum.Dick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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