DOUG RICHARDSON UPDATE MARCH 8

[Doug Richardson]

posted by mkw

 

We got Madalon a new computer but it will not be until April that she will get it to Belize and running. Therefore, I will continue to post news here until she is able to update my website (www.ThompsonSMG.com).

 

Chips have started flying as Type M (M1, M2 & M3) receiver production is underway. Even so, we all got older and slower and my main associate is only available to help me make receivers 6 hours on Monday and Friday. Now that I have done all the receiver engineering, I am turning my attention back to my various other projects that I have partners for. They include: making my Screw-On Grip Mounts, Thompson grip mounts, special bolts, special frames and my semi-auto Thompson gun. I also want to get the workshop manual I wrote back in print.

 

Apparently there are a number of you who are fascinated by the process I follow to make receivers as indicated by the number of questions people phone me and ask. Right now I am completing the primary machining of the receivers, so I will describe that much of it. Here is how that goes:

 

I start out by ordering at least a ton of the proper steel alloy. The steel comes in bars approximately 12 foot long. I have it delivered directly to a saw shop where they cut the bars into receiver length segments. The saw shop delivers the segments directly to my vertical machining center (VMC). The VMC is a large automatic milling machine enclosed in a cabinet and run by a computer/controller in the VMC.

 

The tool magazine in the VMC is loaded with cutters mounted in tool holders. The first stage of the manufacturing, which is what I am doing now, requires 25 different cutters. About half of the cutters are custom made. The other half are available as standards from a number of suppliers.

 

The table of the VMC has a number of specially made fixtures mounted on it. The fixtures are designed for making receivers. The fixtures are never removed from the VMC because it would require too much time to remove and reset-up. This is one of the ways how I am able to keep my costs down. Most shops would use a number of universal work holding vises and and other devices. That is OK for making a few of a part at high cost. I make a lot of parts. Unless everything I use is custom designed for just making receivers, the cost of making a receiver would be too great for most people's budget. The other down side is that to reduce the cost, many manufacturers eliminated many of the details found on the original receivers. Years ago when there were several people making receivers, my competion would tell prospective buyers that the reason their receivers were not as complete as mine were was that my receivers were illegal. That back fired on them because all it did was send the customers running to me. The one I remember most had to do with my receivers having fully formed and properly flat feed ramps. A guy in Nevada claimed he did not do because it was illegal. He did not do it because he did not know how. I have a special machine that does nothing but make feed ramps on the receivers. The primary stage of receiver manufacturing that I am doing now uses two of the mounted fixtures which I call the "blank" fixture and the "primary" fixture

 

A segment is mounted on the "blank" fixture. A program that is permanently loaded into the VMC controller is then run. The VMC selects the proper cutter from the tool magazine and uses it to perform the operations called for by the program. When the VMC is finished with the cutter, it returns it to the magazine and selects the next cutter. In the case of the "blank" fixture program, there are 100 lines of code in the program for the VMC to follow. The result of this program is to create a "blank" by roughing out the receiver height and prepare the segment for mounting on the next ("primary" fixture).

 

The "blank" is then mounted on the "primary" fixture. The primay program is over 1100 lines of code. At the end of this program, the blank looks like a receiver. About 90% of the work necessary to make a receiver has now been done. This is the end of what I am doing now.

 

The main reason that my receivers are so accurately made, is the 1100 lines of code the VMC follows without the receiver being moved. Moving a part is when errors start to cummulate.

 

From the "primary" fixture, the receiver moves on to another VMC and four other machines for various secondary operations.

[Adg105200]

Wow, interesting! It would be nice to see a sped up video of the whole process from start to finish.

 

Does anyone know how many different bits and operations it took during ww2? It's pretty amazing how Savage/A.O. Kept tolerances, seeing as they probably had to move the receivers for each operation.

 

Andrew

[darrylta]

Maybe a segment in "How it's Made" is in order :-)

Darryl

[ppgcowboy]

What a neat process. Thanks for posting. Still would like to try and convince you that a few of us would love to get the barrel removal tool set you used to produce.

[laurencen]

Andrew, todays CNC machines do a great job and quickly, 100% repeatable and profile using any cutter available, in the Thompson era it was the normal to dedicate a single machine to single operations with rows of machines to complete the tasks, they likely had a whole department custom grinding cutters with a tool setter just to replace worn tooling and make changes to hold tolerances, all the operators would do is load and unload the jigs.

[johnnj]

I'll second ppgcowboy's request for the barrel removal tools that Doug used to make.

[anticus]

Doug,

 

Do your "special frames" include the Adaptor Frames you once made for the WH/Kahr semi autos ? If this ever comes to pass i am in for two ! Also highly interested in your own semi auto gun.

[darrylta]

I'd be interested in a pivot plate tool and other misc. tools.

Darryl

[Toaster]

posted by mkw

 

We got Madalon a new computer but it will not be until April that she will get it to Belize and running. Therefore, I will continue to post news here until she is able to update my website (www.ThompsonSMG.com).

 

Chips have started flying as Type M (M1, M2 & M3) receiver production is underway. Even so, we all got older and slower and my main associate is only available to help me make receivers 6 hours on Monday and Friday. Now that I have done all the receiver engineering, I am turning my attention back to my various other projects that I have partners for. They include: making my Screw-On Grip Mounts, Thompson grip mounts, special bolts, special frames and my semi-auto Thompson gun. I also want to get the workshop manual I wrote back in print.

 

 

Hello,

 

I will reserve a more complete introduction for possibly another section on the board.

 

The short message is that I am here to help. While not an exact match for his requests, I posess the skills and discipline required to be a productive, and motivated aid to Doug. I am not invovled in a full-time career, and have means to travel at my discression and offer my services free of charge, in exchange for the experience and knowledge. I am avalable several days a week, and all hours of the day.

 

While our breif discussions over the phone expressed his concerns (Lack of G-Code/Specific Machine experience/outright purchase), I have taken them to heart and been further educating myself, while studying many Thompson-specific attributes. Theres much more to be said, but I wanted to get this out on the board,

 

Any comments are greatly appreciated,

Edited March 10, 2017 by Toaster

[reconbob]

If I understand you correctly you are looking for a job in Doug's shop and you will

work for free in exchange for him teaching you a lifetime of machining skills and

Thompson knowledge?

Nice work if you can get it but unless you have a true passion for machining

and Thompsons I don't think it will happen.

It takes years to become a good machinist even if you are running

CNC's because you must still know and understand the basics about

horsepower,

surface finish, speeds and feeds, endmills, facemills, custom cutters, drills, etc.

In my opinion it would take at least 2 years to become a competent machine

operator which is a long way from being a true machinist. I would say at least

5 years to become an average machinist maybe twice that to be an expert.

Even more important is an interest and desire to know about Thompsons.

(It need not be Thompsons - it's no different than wanting to be a Corvette expert

or a skilled violinist, or a painter.) This passion has to come from within. You can't

one day decide that because you want to work in Doug's shop you will now start

learning about Thompsons. That passion should have already been there. Most

of the "usual suspects" in the Thompson world have carved out their niche by

acquiring true expertise over many years. Guys like PK, Dan Block, Bob Ness

and others

are true artists in a literal sense because making Thompson parts or properly

repairing and restoring them is a true art not an engineering science - you need

Art and science.

Fortunately you won't be able to fake this passion. It's there or it's not. You

can't push yourself to do it. Give yourself a test and read this forum everyday,

especially the archives. Get all the Thompson books you can. If your mind is

like a sponge and take it all in and want more you might be ok. If you only

decide to do this because you want to be an intern in Dougs shop - like

cramming to pass a test for which you have no real interest I think we know

how this ends up.

 

Either way good luck and keep reading the forum!

 

Bob/Phila Ord

[GUNGUY45]

NTMA has a 4 year apprenticeship program, after which you receive your Journeyman's papers.

Most people completing the program are competent machinists, but it depends on your employer allowing you to actually practice the skills.

If after spending 4 years working for Doug you couldn't make the cut, I'd say you never wanted to.

I believe he'd be a very good task master.

 

NTMA papers are recognized in any state that touches the great lakes.

 

Peter Angstadt, Journeyman Metal Patternmaker.

[rpbcps]

NTMA has a 4 year apprenticeship program, after which you receive your Journeyman's papers.

Most people completing the program are competent machinists, but it depends on your employer allowing you to actually practice the skills.

If after spending 4 years working for Doug you couldn't make the cut, I'd say you never wanted to.

I believe he'd be a very good task master.

 

NTMA papers are recognized in any state that touches the great lakes.

 

Peter Angstadt, Journeyman Metal Patternmaker.

When I left school many, many years ago, I began an apprenticeship with a company building locomotives, which sounds like a similar process to your NTMA program. The first year was carried out in the factory's training school making, a set of tools for future use, but through this you gained the relevant experience with all the different machines and processes. Once you completed the first year you 'graduated' to the factory shop floor and began to perfect the skills you had been taught in the training school, but initially working on the simpler production pieces.

 

That was a further three year process to become a toolmaker / fitter, a long journey, but I was young and we were paid.

 

The day I qualified, I resigned and moved on, joining the military, I had decided working in a factory was not for me.

 

Doug has a wrote a few books, so I recently ordered a set, which Madalon arranged to ship to me.

 

Stay safe

Richard