Arthur Fliegenheimer Posted March 7, 2009 Report Share Posted March 7, 2009 (edited) I don't think of the serial number section in, Thompson: The American Legend, or, The Ultimate Thompson Book, as superfluous. While Gordon's work is much more in depth and complete on this one subject, the number of books published by Gordon is very small (250 to date?). I doubt most of the people who own American Legend (or Roger Cox's book) know of its existence. While this one section is not that important to advance collectors and researchers who own Gordon's book, Colt Thompson Serial Numbers, it does offer a lot of value for most purchasers of this new book. If Hill actually had records for the shipping dates for considerably more than the first 1000 or so Colt TSMG's, then the 160+ pages of serial numbers, most with only the date of manufacture info beside them, would justify the amount of space devoted to this. Cox only printed the serial number if he had info to place beside it. Do you know if Hill has substantially updated this large portion of his previous book? I am not aware of AOC sales records being uncovered in the last dozen years since his last publication. What is the value to the general firearms enthusiast to have a list of 15,000 serial numbers where information is practically non existent beyond the first couple of thousand numbers? One can still find used copies of "The American Legend" for less than what it sold for back n 96. I would think with the ubiquity of the internet, that was not the case when Hill's book came out, it is presumptuous to suggest that those interested in this subject are unaware of Cox's book and GH's periodical. Do Luger collectors and enthusiasts not know of all the books related to that subject? How many copies of a book does Collector Grade normally publish? The $150 price suggests that the number is not the same as those recommended by Oprah's book club Edited March 7, 2009 by Arthur Fliegenheimer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalbert Posted March 7, 2009 Author Report Share Posted March 7, 2009 One can still find used copies of "The American Legend" for less than what it sold for back n 96. Arthur, Please point me to where the used copies of Tracie's book may be found for less than what they sold for back in '96. I would be interested in purchasing several of them. David Albert dalbert@sturmgewehr.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Fliegenheimer Posted March 7, 2009 Report Share Posted March 7, 2009 One can still find used copies of "The American Legend" for less than what it sold for back n 96. Arthur, Please point me to where the used copies of Tracie's book may be found for less than what they sold for back in '96. I would be interested in purchasing several of them. David Albert dalbert@sturmgewehr.com Was that the only passage in the post you objected to? Well, you can still get "American Legend" for $85 and I have seen it for $5 to $10 less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireMerc Posted March 7, 2009 Report Share Posted March 7, 2009 What did they sell for in '96? The least expensive that I saw in recent years for one in excellent condition was $75 and I've seen them sell for $85 - $95 on the upper end as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Highseas Posted March 7, 2009 Report Share Posted March 7, 2009 ABE Books, which represents thousands of booksellers, currently lists 3 copies, the cheapest one being offered for $146.50. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Fliegenheimer Posted March 7, 2009 Report Share Posted March 7, 2009 ABE Books, which represents thousands of booksellers, currently lists 3 copies, the cheapest one being offered for $146.50. I guess they didn't look too hard since idsa books has it for $85. http://www.idsabooks.com/cgi-bin/idb455/101474 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalbert Posted March 7, 2009 Author Report Share Posted March 7, 2009 ABE Books, which represents thousands of booksellers, currently lists 3 copies, the cheapest one being offered for $146.50. I guess they didn't look too hard since idsa books has it for $85. http://www.idsabooks.com/cgi-bin/idb455/101474 Arthur, I refer back to your statement regarding the ability to find them for less than they sold for in '96. $85 is not that price. IDSA's listed price may be the lowest, and the book is still apparently offered at the cover price. I'd be interested to determine if they have any left. I've happily purchased several books from them in the past, and they feature an awesome selection of firearm titles. However, their online inventory list is not always up to date. On two occasions, I have orderd a book from them, and had the transaction cancelled due to the item being out of stock, although it was still listed on their website. Most copies of "Thompson: The American Legend" are offered for above the cover price now. It is out of print, and only existing shelf stock of retailers remain, along with used copies. If anyone needs a copy, looks like IDSA would be the best place right now... All that being said, I'm really looking forward to the release of the new book. As I stated before, several board members here contributed to the effort. (I can think of 5 new contributors to the book who are well known on this board) It will probably become the single most referenced work on the TSMG to date, and is to be published in greater number than any previous book on the Thompson. I'm sure there will be many new discoveries to find in the book, and I know of at least one item that will make almost every Thompson aficionado say "Wow!" out loud. David Albert dalbert@sturmgewehr.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Highseas Posted March 7, 2009 Report Share Posted March 7, 2009 ABE Books, which represents thousands of booksellers, currently lists 3 copies, the cheapest one being offered for $146.50. I guess they didn't look too hard since idsa books has it for $85. http://www.idsabooks.com/cgi-bin/idb455/101474 Nice pleasant reply. For those who are interested, ABE Books is not a search service but a central online site for a large group of booksellers who must be members to have their inventory listed. It's international in scope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Fliegenheimer Posted March 7, 2009 Report Share Posted March 7, 2009 ABE Books, which represents thousands of booksellers, currently lists 3 copies, the cheapest one being offered for $146.50. I guess they didn't look too hard since idsa books has it for $85. http://www.idsabooks.com/cgi-bin/idb455/101474 Arthur, I refer back to your statement regarding the ability to find them for less than they sold for in '96. $85 is not that price. IDSA's listed price may be the lowest, and the book is still apparently offered at the cover price. I'd be interested to determine if they have any left. I've happily purchased several books from them in the past, and they feature an awesome selection of firearm titles. However, their online inventory list is not always up to date. On two occasions, I have orderd a book from them, and had the transaction cancelled due to the item being out of stock, although it was still listed on their website. Most copies of "Thompson: The American Legend" are offered for above the cover price now. It is out of print, and only existing shelf stock of retailers remain, along with used copies. If anyone needs a copy, looks like IDSA would be the best place right now... All that being said, I'm really looking forward to the release of the new book. As I stated before, several board members here contributed to the effort. (I can think of 5 new contributors to the book who are well known on this board) It will probably become the single most referenced work on the TSMG to date, and is to be published in greater number than any previous book on the Thompson. I'm sure there will be many new discoveries to find in the book, and I know of at least one item that will make almost every Thompson aficionado say "Wow!" out loud. David Albert dalbert@sturmgewehr.com I have seen used copies of Hill's book sell for less than the original $85 price (I believe that was the amount) since its 1996 release. I suppose I could have chronicled these sales, but I didn't foresee it being a bone of contention in subsequent years. At any rate, FireMerc noticed this as well. Can I vouch for IDSA's scrupulous policy on the timely updating of their website? No. However, they say they got one copy for that price. Even if it was sold yesterday, how does that change the fact that Hill's book does sell at, or lower, than the 1996 price? The fact that sellers ask silly prices for Cox's book as well doesn't mean that you can't buy it for less, if not less than its 1982 price. The only other Collector Grade Publications near the $150 range is the FAL one. Frank Innamico's "Semper Fi Fifty" new release is a comparative bargain at $75. With all the extra material contributed by machinegunboards.com members, it is even more puzzling why Hill even needed the 160+ pages devoted to every serial number, whether the number has info or not. Care to share with board members this astounding nugget of information found in the pages of Hill's book? It could only boost sales. Is it as earth-shattering as TD's SAR article on Kilgore? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Fliegenheimer Posted March 7, 2009 Report Share Posted March 7, 2009 ABE Books, which represents thousands of booksellers, currently lists 3 copies, the cheapest one being offered for $146.50. I guess they didn't look too hard since idsa books has it for $85. http://www.idsabooks.com/cgi-bin/idb455/101474 Nice pleasant reply. For those who are interested, ABE Books is not a search service but a central online site for a large group of booksellers who must be members to have their inventory listed. It's international in scope. Do you have stock in ABE? How could you possibly take offense to a post that merely provides information on where to find the same book cheaper? ebay is international in scope as well and contains a large group of booksellers. Does membership in ABE require a blood oath or something? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richard w. Posted March 7, 2009 Report Share Posted March 7, 2009 (edited) I would have been content to have a simple "Errata" list for the serial numbers in Hill's first book. Even some kind of reformatting (smaller font) so that it doesn't take so much space would suffice. (It does take up almost 1/3 of that book, BTW.) However, I am eagerly awaiting my copy of the new book, no matter what. Can never have enough Thompson reference books... Edited March 8, 2009 by richard w. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wwl Posted March 8, 2009 Report Share Posted March 8, 2009 If you were to compare Tracie's book " American Legend" to Gordan's book--is there much difference in how many serial numbers can be attributed to a buyer? In other words how close are they in known purchasers? Also. have many new purchasers been added in the last few years? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Fliegenheimer Posted March 8, 2009 Report Share Posted March 8, 2009 If you were to compare Tracie's book " American Legend" to Gordan's book--is there much difference in how many serial numbers can be attributed to a buyer? In other words how close are they in known purchasers? Also. have many new purchasers been added in the last few years? Hill's book only mentions the original purchaser of the Colt TSMG from AOC. However, when there is no information about a serial number, and that is the case for the majority of the 15,000 numbers, these numbers are still included in the 160+ pages. If only the serial numbers were listed that had info, then the number of pages would be around 25-30. There is no indication that Hill's current book has made this logical trimming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD. Posted March 8, 2009 Report Share Posted March 8, 2009 Arthur, I have not seen that section of the book. However, I am sure Tracie's decisions on how to present information in book form will be based on sound marketing principals. After all, every book he has been associated with has sold out and all his magazine articles are a must have for the serious Thompson collector. I would encourage you to attend a TATA Show and Shoot at Tracie's home some August. When you see his collection, I believe most of your questions will be answered. I dare say Tracie has spent more money in archival supplies for Thompson documentation than most collectors have spent on their entire collection. You would be very humbled to see just some of the documentation he has collected on the Thompson. Aside from all the Thompson stuff, the people are simply THE BEST. I will be glad to have you as my guest at this years TATA Show. All that said, you do make some good points. We will both see if this serial number information is superfluous in the very near future. But David's right, this is going to be one hell of a book! Why don't you consider writing an article about some facet of the Colt Thompson. I know everyone on the Board would enjoy your efforts. Please give this some thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalbert Posted March 21, 2009 Author Report Share Posted March 21, 2009 All, I'm bringing this thread back to the top again, as we're getting closer to the release of Tracie's new book. The latest TATA newsletter shared a few more details. Apparently the book will weigh 6 pounds, and have 872 printed pages. Orders placed now will have priority on shipping, and again, checks, money orders, and credits cards will not be charged or cashed until the books are in hand. David Albert dalbert@sturmgewehr.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Fliegenheimer Posted March 21, 2009 Report Share Posted March 21, 2009 According to the USDA, G.H.'s book weighs 10.8 lbs. That's $1.63 an ounce for prime Colt TSMG serial numbers in depth info, L & C drums info, U.S. Navy, U.S. Marine Corps, FBI TSMG info, and SVDM and Dillinger filler. Hill's book at 6lbs is $1.56 an ounce for an unknown "Wow!" item, updated info on all manufacture of TSMG and L & C drums, 3 chapters of filler (from previous edition) and 125 pgs of extra fat. The extra "Wow!" factor might off-set the extra fat intake and satisfy the daily recommended allowance of vitamins, minerals, amino acids and nutrients that are required by the Thompson aficionado. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalbert Posted March 21, 2009 Author Report Share Posted March 21, 2009 According to the USDA, G.H.'s book weighs 10.8 lbs. That's $1.63 an ounce for prime Colt TSMG serial numbers in depth info, L & C drums info, U.S. Navy, U.S. Marine Corps, FBI TSMG info, and SVDM and Dillinger filler. Hill's book at 6lbs is $1.56 an ounce for an unknown "Wow!" item, updated info on all manufacture of TSMG and L & C drums, 3 chapters of filler (from previous edition) and 125 pgs of extra fat. The extra "Wow!" factor might off-set the extra fat intake and satisfy the daily recommended allowance of vitamins, minerals, amino acids and nutrients that are required by the Thompson aficionado. Arthur, Your dismissive attitude towards a book you have not yet seen is predictable. I'll bet you're one of the first to buy it, though. While I will not completely reveal the details of the "Wow!" item I mentioned previously (and that you lampoon in your latest post), I will say that the "Wow!" is a Thompson Submachine Gun model designed by Auto-Ordnance during the Colt production run that has not been documented previously. David Albert dalbert@sturmgewehr.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Fliegenheimer Posted March 21, 2009 Report Share Posted March 21, 2009 According to the USDA, G.H.'s book weighs 10.8 lbs. That's $1.63 an ounce for prime Colt TSMG serial numbers in depth info, L & C drums info, U.S. Navy, U.S. Marine Corps, FBI TSMG info, and SVDM and Dillinger filler. Hill's book at 6lbs is $1.56 an ounce for an unknown "Wow!" item, updated info on all manufacture of TSMG and L & C drums, 3 chapters of filler (from previous edition) and 125 pgs of extra fat. The extra "Wow!" factor might off-set the extra fat intake and satisfy the daily recommended allowance of vitamins, minerals, amino acids and nutrients that are required by the Thompson aficionado. Arthur, Your dismissive attitude towards a book you have not yet seen is predictable. I'll bet you're one of the first to buy it, though. While I will not completely reveal the details of the "Wow!" item I mentioned previously (and that you lampoon in your latest post), I will say that the "Wow!" is a Thompson Submachine Gun model designed by Auto-Ordnance during the Colt production run that has not been documented previously. David Albert dalbert@sturmgewehr.com You could say I am being whimsical, but I am hardly being dismissive of Hill's latest book. However, it was confirmed that he did indeed include the same 160+ pages of serial numbers from his last edition. What TSMG nut wouldn't get Hill's latest offering? If nothing else, it got you to partially reveal the golden nugget. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalbert Posted March 21, 2009 Author Report Share Posted March 21, 2009 What TSMG nut wouldn't get Hill's latest offering? If nothing else, it got you to partially reveal the golden nugget.[/b][/color] Arthur, Glad to hear you'll be getting a copy. And yes, being a "TSMG nut" is something we all share. You ought to take TD up on his offer to be a guest sometime at the Show and Shoot at Tracie's home in August. It's heaven for a TSMG nut. I'd even buy you a beer (or other beverage) at the evening festivities. I realize you may think your post is what drove me to partially reveal the "golden nugget," as you call it, but there was some forethought to it, and it's not the only nugget in the lode. I almost posted the information this morning, but I anticipated you would quip about something related to the book, and it would produce a lead-in for me, as it did. Hopefully it will bring attention to the pre-sales, and everyone on the board can be among the first to get their copies. Thanks! David Albert dalbert@sturmgewehr.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD. Posted April 4, 2009 Report Share Posted April 4, 2009 Arthur, My offer is still open. It is a show and shoot experience you would never forget. I may even let you read "Tommy," the first book written about the Thompson Submachine Gun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalbert Posted April 6, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 6, 2009 All, Collector Grade Publications will mail book dealers a flyer this week advertising Tracie Hill's "The Ultimate Thompson Book." It can be seen at the link below. You should place your order now for this book, as it will be out very soon. "The Ultimate Thompson Book," by Tracie Hill - Collector Grade Publications Flyer Enjoy! David Albert dalbert@sturmgewehr.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoscoeTurner Posted April 6, 2009 Report Share Posted April 6, 2009 (edited) For those of you who have yet to join The American Thompson Association an order form for a signed copy direct from Tracie Hill was included in the 2nd QTR 2009 newsletter issue. Edited April 6, 2009 by RoscoeTurner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdvancedArms Posted April 24, 2009 Report Share Posted April 24, 2009 What does the current ETA on the book look like? Any anyone received an update? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalbert Posted April 24, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 24, 2009 What does the current ETA on the book look like? Any anyone received an update? AdvancedArms, I'm waiting on an update from Tracie, but I understand the books were scheduled to be shipped by the printer in Canada last weekend for delivery to Collector Grade. I'll let you know when the first book sighting occurs... David Albert dalbert@sturmgewehr.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wwl Posted April 28, 2009 Report Share Posted April 28, 2009 Is there an update on the shipping date of Tracie's book on orders sent to the TATA? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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