Rate Of Fire

[SubmarinerFan]

Here are a few videos. I know it is tough to tell, but the rate of fire on the first two videos seem to be higher than the last. I'm assuming the first two videos are 1928s (600-700 RPM) and the last is probably not a Colt.

 

Is it just me, or does the rate of fire seem higher in the guns on the first two videos. Maybe it is just the quality of the video? Maybe it is the ammo used? Assuming the last video is a Savage gun, isn't the RPM at least as high as the Colt 1928s?

 

Colt Guns:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NruK8DHE_L4...feature=related

 

 

 

Seemingly slower Thompson (possibly Savage):

 

[reconbob]

Yes, unless you know the guns are shooting the same ammo and are in

similar condition the rate of fire is inconclusive. The gun fired indoors has

the shells barely getting clear of the gun whereas the outdoor guns they

are ejecting much higher and farther...

 

Bob

[gijive]

Here are a few videos. I know it is tough to tell, but the rate of fire on the first two videos seem to be higher than the last. I'm assuming the first two videos are 1928s (600-700 RPM) and the last is probably not a Colt.

 

Is it just me, or does the rate of fire seem higher in the guns on the first two videos. Maybe it is just the quality of the video? Maybe it is the ammo used? Assuming the last video is a Savage gun, isn't the RPM at least as high as the Colt 1928s?

 

Colt Guns:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NruK8DHE_L4...feature=related

 

 

 

Seemingly slower Thompson (possibly Savage):

 

 

The second video under the heading Colt guns is a 1928 Navy Model that had the internal parts replaced with a 1921 actuator, spring and buffer system for the firing demonstration. The increased rate of fire over the 1928 Model is due to the 1921 internals.

[darrylta]

The fire rate comparison between a Colt Navy and a GI 28 will be exactly the same, they both use the same bolt, lock and spring system. If there is a fire rate delta between the two types, it would be as a result of differing internal parts wear. As in a worn blish lock or receiver lock slots ( W Hurley), a weak recoil spring and lubrication variables.

My 2 cents,

Darryl

Edited September 7, 2010 by darrylta

[TheGunny]

I have a WW2 era M-1. Depending on what ammo I use, it will zip along at roughly 750 RPM or chug like a locomotive at roughly 550 rpm. This is with a clean gun, lightly lubricated.

 

Damnest thing I've ever seen.

 

My MP-40 seems to rarely change cyclic rates, but depending on what 9mm I use, it will throw the brass either nearer or farther from the gun.

[mnshooter]

I have a WW2 era M-1. Depending on what ammo I use, it will zip along at roughly 750 RPM or chug like a locomotive at roughly 550 rpm. This is with a clean gun, lightly lubricated.

 

Damnest thing I've ever seen.

 

My MP-40 seems to rarely change cyclic rates, but depending on what 9mm I use, it will throw the brass either nearer or farther from the gun.

Have you chronographed the various ammo fired in that gun?

I'm wondering how velocity relates to rate of fire.

Also, was it brass or nickled cases?

At knob creek, I fired a 50rd drum full of brass cased Remington commercial 230gr fmj in a 1928, immediately followed by a drum of the same, but with nickled cases. The nickled cases seemed to fly out noticeably faster. I couldn't really hear the fire rates, because it was at the night shoot, and there was a 50 bmg about 25ft on either side, and three MG42's about 10 feet to my right, and a minigun about 20 feet to the right, and... well, you get the idea. I believe the smile muscles in my face were permanently reshaped from that night.

[TheGunny]

Have you chronographed the various ammo fired in that gun?

I'm wondering how velocity relates to rate of fire.

Also, was it brass or nickled cases?

At knob creek, I fired a 50rd drum full of brass cased Remington commercial 230gr fmj in a 1928, immediately followed by a drum of the same, but with nickled cases. The nickled cases seemed to fly out noticeably faster. I couldn't really hear the fire rates, because it was at the night shoot, and there was a 50 bmg about 25ft on either side, and three MG42's about 10 feet to my right, and a minigun about 20 feet to the right, and... well, you get the idea. I believe the smile muscles in my face were permanently reshaped from that night.

I've never chronographed any of the ammo, I just know what works in my gun and what ammo won't. I've never fired nickel cased ammo out of mine, so I can't comment on that.

 

I know I'll never fire steel cased wolf out of it again. That cost me a bolt and a new extractor! :angry:

[mnshooter]

That is a very valuable warning. Thanks

[Z3BigDaddy]

Have you chronographed the various ammo fired in that gun?

I'm wondering how velocity relates to rate of fire.

Also, was it brass or nickled cases?

At knob creek, I fired a 50rd drum full of brass cased Remington commercial 230gr fmj in a 1928, immediately followed by a drum of the same, but with nickled cases. The nickled cases seemed to fly out noticeably faster. I couldn't really hear the fire rates, because it was at the night shoot, and there was a 50 bmg about 25ft on either side, and three MG42's about 10 feet to my right, and a minigun about 20 feet to the right, and... well, you get the idea. I believe the smile muscles in my face were permanently reshaped from that night.

I've never chronographed any of the ammo, I just know what works in my gun and what ammo won't. I've never fired nickel cased ammo out of mine, so I can't comment on that.

 

I know I'll never fire steel cased wolf out of it again. That cost me a bolt and a new extractor! :angry:

 

You blew up a bolt?

 

[Shattered]

I know I'll never fire steel cased wolf out of it again. That cost me a bolt and a new extractor! :angry:

 

 

I really don't think steel cased ammo was to blame. We used steel cased 45 ammo throughout WW2. Haven't heard much about bolts getting wrecked during the war. Now my WH bolt however... Ira used some crappy materials making those guns. All about saving a buck rather than using WW2/Savage parts. I had two nice big chips taken out of the bolt face rim... and that was with brass ammo. I reclaimed that bolt, however. Welded it all up and machined it for my 9mm project. Apparently my weld is stronger than Ira's bolt. It's running fine in 9mm.

[RoscoeTurner]

We used steel cased 45 ammo throughout WW2. Haven't heard much about bolts getting wrecked during the war.

 

True but they did have a problem with it in Thompsons by the cases damaging bolt faces. The problem was a combination of immediate action drills mixed with radius of the feed ramp. The drill was changed and a special reamer was designed to chamfer the radius around the chamber.

 

Pages 447-450 ATII.

 

I do not shoot Wolf in any firearm I own that I care a lot about. The only one I really shoot with any frequency with Wolf is a Sten gun. Parts are easy to find and cheap.

[TheGunny]

I know I'll never fire steel cased wolf out of it again. That cost me a bolt and a new extractor! :angry:

 

 

You blew up a bolt?

 

 

The bolt could probably be repaired. If blew about a half inch section off the bottom, around the face and bent the extractor 180 degrees back. Also jammed the bolt back in the receiver. (If I can find the old bolt I'll post pictures)

 

Bought 500 rounds of Wolf. The explosion happened on the third round. It's never happen with the thousands of brass rounds I've put through my gun.

 

Hence my statement.............I'll never fire Wolf through my Thompson again (whatever the cause!)