Steave Posted October 11, 2006 Report Share Posted October 11, 2006 (edited) I am brokering an exceptional Colt 21/28 Overstamp for a customer of mine. I would call this gun a 95% specimen with bright bluing and great wood with the exception of several minor dings that one would expect. This gun is all original, it has not been refinished, had the wood replaced, etc, just a damn nice 22xx SN range gun; no surprises, no disappointments. It comes in an original FBI case that is good condition, but it is not mint, the case mfg. is Pollacks Polly Brand. Also included are four 20 rd. mags and a WW II "L" drum. If you have been waiting for a nice Colt to come along this is the one, I can assure you there are very few unmolested Colts in this condition around. I have numerous pics I can send for serious inquiries, but please, no pic collectors. Please drop me a direct email or call if you are interested, steave@flash.net $39K Steave Wayman 214-265-0010 Edited January 22, 2009 by Steave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john Posted October 11, 2006 Report Share Posted October 11, 2006 Nice looking gun....really outstanding wood! http://www.machinegunbooks.com/forums/invboard1_1_2/upload/html/emoticons/tongue.gif Wish I had the spare cash. Good luck selling! john Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philasteen Posted October 12, 2006 Report Share Posted October 12, 2006 Steave, is that an original '28 horizontal foregrip? Hard to tell from the pic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Jr Posted October 12, 2006 Report Share Posted October 12, 2006 QUOTE (Steave @ Oct 11 2006, 02:08 PM) I am brokering an exceptional Colt 21/28 Overstamp for a customer of mine. I would call this gun a 95% specimen with bright bluing and great wood with the exception of several minor dings that one would expect. This gun is all original, it has not been refinished, had the wood replaced, etc, just a damn nice 22xx SN range gun; no surprises, no disappointments. It comes in an original FBI case that is good condition, but it is not mint, the case mfg. is Pollacks Polly Brand. Also included are four 20 rd. mags and a WW II "L" drum. If you have been waiting for a nice Colt to come along this is the one, I can assure you there are very few unmolested Colts in this condition around. I have numerous pics I can send for serious inquiries, but please, no pic collectors. Please drop me a direct email or call if you are interested, steave@flash.net $39K Steave Wayman 214-265-0010 http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c260/steave1wayman/P9220142copy.jpg Wow. Nearly 40 thousand dollars. http://www.machinegunbooks.com/forums/invboard1_1_2/upload/html/emoticons/blink.gif At nearly 40 thousand dollars, one would not expect any dings in the wood. http://www.machinegunbooks.com/forums/invboard1_1_2/upload/html/emoticons/unsure.gif The SN is what? Most people on this board who would be colt collectors have Gordon's book and know about the range, so why not disclose the SN up front. Is there something to hide? All dealers hate picture collectors, but that picture is far from enough to get anyone interested. And what markings are on the 20 round mags? Coming with a WW2 L drum has no real interest for a colt collector. Sorry to be so harsh, but at nearly $40K you are going to have to do better than that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steave Posted October 12, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 12, 2006 Well, John, I'm sorry you don't feel like this is priced fairly, I suggest you pass on this piece or call me and make an offer. Yes, it is nearly $40K and yes there are a few dings in the wood, the gun isn't mint, but it is *much* nicer than the VAST majority of Colt's that are offered for sale. Find another one for sale that is this nice, much easier said than done. I guess I should also apologize to you that the drum was lost years ago, shame on that careless deputy for taking his Colt out with a non-original drum. Would you prefer I advertise it with a NY drum and ship it with a WW II drum? Regarding the SN, no, I am not trying to hide anything, and frankly think your implication is completely uncalled for. Yes, we all have Gordon's book and it is easy to look up, but I see no reason to broadcast the SN out to the entire world on an internet board. maybe I'm just funny that way, but I fail to see how that makes me less than honest. I do agree that it tough to tell much from that picture, but as I said, I have numerous pics I can send to anyone that is interested. Philasteen, yes the horizontal foregrip is original. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ftc3906 Posted October 12, 2006 Report Share Posted October 12, 2006 I have always wanted to ask since seeing your ads in Shotgun News: Do you pronounce your first name as "Steve" or "Ste-AVE" with emphasis on the AVE as in AVEnue? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldFalGuy Posted October 12, 2006 Report Share Posted October 12, 2006 Guys, Any potential buyer is free to contact Steave and he will give you the serial number- end of story. Of the pictures he has this one is of the complete weapon and granted doesn't yeild much detail, but neither doe4sn any other picture of a complete weapon. I would find it hard to chose what pic to post when one has more than several to choose from and I have seen them. Don't forget he mentioned this one has an original case and thus affects the price of the package. If you really are interested then ask and ye shall receive, Steave doesn't mind a bit. Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Fliegenheimer Posted October 12, 2006 Report Share Posted October 12, 2006 Steave, If the pics, inside and out, substantiate the 95% condition and originality of a true surviving Colt Navy with correct stock and horizontal grip with offset Enfiedl swivels, and early 1921 riveted actuator, then $39K is easily inside the parameters of market value. As to JJ's post, to expect zero handling and character marks on the wood for an 85 year-old weapon is unrealistic and the lack there of would be suspicious. Aside from the WWII L drum, an original so so condition FBI case included in the package makes the TSMG alone $36-37K(?) As to Phil and Lancer's valid criticisms, if you provided the serial number and more detailed pics available off the bat, without making it exclusive to on request emailers, you would have only increased the good will for a sale. Why else come to this board if not only to find perspective buyers but to get endorsements? Otherwise an ad on Subguns, Sturmgewehr, or Gunbroker would suffice. What possible unintended consequences would result from disclosing the serial number of a TSMG for sale on the internet? Of all firearms, the serial numbers of NFA weapons are already recorded with ATF so where is there an opportunity for skulduggery? Is the photo you selected a fair representation of the quality of the others you have? If so, you might consider taking pics outdoors without a flash to capture the true look of the finish and wood. However, no matter how high quality the pics, an in person examination would be obligatory before a buyer should consumate the deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beechnut Posted October 12, 2006 Report Share Posted October 12, 2006 It's a tired and repeating trend, that whenever anying TSMG goes up for sale, 10 guys pile out of a car and declare how outrageous a price is. Steave is a top notch dealer in the DFW area. I'd trust his assesment. If someone is seriously interested in the item, they should contact Steave directly. Lobbing out spears here isn't going to do you any good and just makes you look like one of the trendy "that's too much" guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sig Posted October 12, 2006 Report Share Posted October 12, 2006 I see no reason that Steave deserves any criticism here for anything. No SN? Give me a break Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wjwatson Posted October 12, 2006 Report Share Posted October 12, 2006 I have dealt directly with Steave and found him to be top notch, honest and true. He does not deserve the arrows. W. J. Watson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Jr Posted October 12, 2006 Report Share Posted October 12, 2006 QUOTE (Steave @ Oct 11 2006, 11:47 PM) Well, John, I'm sorry you don't feel like this is priced fairly, I suggest you pass on this piece or call me and make an offer. Yes, it is nearly $40K and yes there are a few dings in the wood, the gun isn't mint, but it is *much* nicer than the VAST majority of Colt's that are offered for sale. Find another one for sale that is this nice, much easier said than done. I guess I should also apologize to you that the drum was lost years ago, shame on that careless deputy for taking his Colt out with a non-original drum. Would you prefer I advertise it with a NY drum and ship it with a WW II drum? Regarding the SN, no, I am not trying to hide anything, and frankly think your implication is completely uncalled for. Yes, we all have Gordon's book and it is easy to look up, but I see no reason to broadcast the SN out to the entire world on an internet board. maybe I'm just funny that way, but I fail to see how that makes me less than honest. I do agree that it tough to tell much from that picture, but as I said, I have numerous pics I can send to anyone that is interested. Philasteen, yes the horizontal foregrip is original. Steave, I am not out to question your integrity as a dealer or even as a person. There is nothing I said in that post that I wouldn't say on the phone or in person to you or anyone else. I speak my mind, so if you can't handle that, sorry. When you post on a discussion board, you are opening yourself and your wares to criticism. In this day and age on the internet and especially on a board devoted to the Thompson, people expect more information than that. Everyone who takes Shotgun News knows your a dealer and have been one for years. I have never heard of you being dishonest. I actually have your card and a copy of your SOT in my safe. Now... colt collectors and Thompson enthusiasts in general expect to see more gun pictures, the SN, pictures of the accessories, any history documented, all the good stuff...without having to ask for them. It's a "nearly $40,000 gun" and it deserves more than "Its a 95% colt for 40K with a crappy picture" post. As for the price...you won't get it. You might get $34K. http://www.machinegunbooks.com/forums/invboard1_1_2/upload/html/emoticons/wink.gif Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sig Posted October 12, 2006 Report Share Posted October 12, 2006 Just thought I toss this into the thread. Here is an ad posted on this forum, without serial #. With 324 views I frankly doubt anyone who posted on this particular TSMG Steave is selling, could tell me they did not see it. Funny I could not find any critism on a missing SN? What am I missing? Whoops had to copy the ad! Posted: Sep 6 2006, 06:25 PM New Member Group: Regular Group Posts: 10 Member No.: 2651 Joined: 20-June 06 Hey all, Unforseen circumstances are requiring that I sell a piece I never wanted to part with. I have a Colt 1921AC Thompson for sale, nice overall condition, all original and matching. Price is $28,500 and terms are 100% upfront + actual shipping. Thought I'd give the boards first crack at her. Email for specifics if an interested buyer and I can provide history. Dave Bane MarColMar Firearms LLC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philasteen Posted October 12, 2006 Report Share Posted October 12, 2006 I find the fact that the original horizontal foregrip is on this one is a very, very interesting detail. Thanks for clarifying that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Jr Posted October 13, 2006 Report Share Posted October 13, 2006 QUOTE (Sig @ Oct 12 2006, 05:21 PM) Just thought I toss this into the thread. Here is an ad posted on this forum, without serial #. With 324 views I frankly doubt anyone who posted on this particular TSMG Steave is selling, could tell me they did not see it. Funny I could not find any critism on a missing SN? What am I missing? Whoops had to copy the ad! Posted: Sep 6 2006, 06:25 PM New Member Group: Regular Group Posts: 10 Member No.: 2651 Joined: 20-June 06 Hey all, Unforseen circumstances are requiring that I sell a piece I never wanted to part with. I have a Colt 1921AC Thompson for sale, nice overall condition, all original and matching. Price is $28,500 and terms are 100% upfront + actual shipping. Thought I'd give the boards first crack at her. Email for specifics if an interested buyer and I can provide history. Dave Bane MarColMar Firearms LLC That one is priced fairly for one thing. When people get up into the "rich dummies only please" asking prices, it changes things a bit. But in all fairness, I missed that ad and I am surprised that no body asked for the SN. If I were a colt collector and were in the market, the SN question would be the first one I'd ask. The Thompson market is a unique market in that regard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Fliegenheimer Posted October 13, 2006 Report Share Posted October 13, 2006 Sig, Perhaps the observations that the ad had #22XX instead of the whole number should be posed as more of a puzzle than a criticism. True Navy Colt's in this condition are unusual and this board thrives on the arcane. If dealer Steave mentioned the reason for redacting the serial number and the poor quality of the only pic then I doubt this would come up at all. Why post on a fanatic TSMG collector board, not a sales board, and not indulge the members with as much info as possible? Why not allow access to all the TSMG pics on his photobucket site? Had this been an ad on Sturmgewehr only Buddy would have made the same comment as others here before it got zapped. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny.45 Posted October 13, 2006 Report Share Posted October 13, 2006 The wealth of knowledge & expertise on the TSMG Board is amazing. A truly great resource for the Thompson Collector. This Board has assisted many a collector from making a mistake. But in order to achieve this end all the facts/details must be present. FWIW These Colt TSMGs are obviously not as nice With obvious flaws, But The S/Ns are clearly revealed? http://gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?...p?Item=58003342 http://gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?...p?Item=58337013 http://www.sturmgewehr.com/webBBS/nfa4sale....cgi?read=79758 http://gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?...p?Item=58068034 Thanks, Johnny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldFalGuy Posted October 13, 2006 Report Share Posted October 13, 2006 I have seen that last Navy ont he net before- its a local gun for me- I remember it because it has a smooth barrel, not something I readily think is correct by any strech of the imagination and for that reason it is way over priced for that reason alone at 27K. Clarification anyone? Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sig Posted October 13, 2006 Report Share Posted October 13, 2006 Johnny.45 I am talking only about the recent ad on this board, which did not have a SN and yet did not get the same scrutiny as Steave did, not other board ads, . Call it what you want I am just trying to point out inequity in the crticism that's all. Arthur I am not going to argue your points, your questions really are for Steave to ponder. Again, as I said to Johnny.45, just pointing out an observed inequity. Bottom line, what's fair is fair and I just don't think Steave was treated fairly compared to other posts, specifically in reference to the SN, and pointed to facts to back it up. I could step into the muck on other comments but will not, as I am in agreement with some, maybe even those from our infamous Arthur. Acckk Can't believe I said that! michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lancer Posted October 13, 2006 Report Share Posted October 13, 2006 QUOTE (Sig @ Oct 13 2006, 06:21 AM) Bottom line, what's fair is fair and I just don't think Steave was treated fairly compared to other posts, specifically in reference to the SN, and pointed to facts to back it up. michael Sig You seem to be saying if we don't speak up in every single instance when someone doesn't post a SN we can never speak up. We all know that none of these boards work this way, life ain't always "fair". Knowing that buyers that are willing and able to spend 30-40 k on a Thompson are few and far between, a perceptive seller would take my comment, fair or not, and learn something from it. I know that there many of you that don't beleive in posting NFA sn's on the net. I have posted my own sn here in the past and if I'm making a mistake in doing this I wish someone would post a "worst case scenario" because I just can't see the down side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steave Posted October 13, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 13, 2006 Well, I certainly did not intend for a simple ad to become such an issue. I am not going to argue with anyone regarding the price of the gun or my decision not to post the complete SN. I will only say that, as everyone knows, the majority of Colt’s around are below 90% condition, with the majority of those probably below 85%; this gun is MUCH nicer than that and it is reflected by the price. Frankly, the price should only be a concern for a potential buyer and I find it humorous that so many people have decided it is overpriced without seeing any of the pictures, getting any additional info, etc. Some folks seem quick to make a judgment regarding the price because it is more than they want to pay. On to the serial number. The SN certainly isn’t a state secret and as someone else posted all anyone has to do is email me or pick up the phone, both my email address and phone number are clearly stated in the ad. I really do not have a problem posting SN’s on the board, however, since this is a gun I am brokering and not one that I own, I thought it prudent not to post the SN. I can assure everyone that this was not part of a deception or nefarious motive; it was just what I chose to do. As a side point, this gun has been in a private collection for over 25 years and is not a “problem†gun. Unless I am addressing a legitimate question this will be my last post on this subject, I see nothing to be gained by arguing on the internet. To those of you that know me and/or have done business with me and have spoken up, I appreciate and thank you for your support. I’d like to think I have an excellent reputation and will not do anything to tarnish it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kyle Posted October 14, 2006 Report Share Posted October 14, 2006 QUOTE (PhilOhio @ Oct 13 2006, 10:41 AM)The reason it triggered all the comments was because it was indeed well above the market, despite what you say. There is probably no group of people more knowledgeable of that market than the collection of Thompson fanciers on this board. They do know. Phil... You know that I respect you tremendously. I promise you, Steave is as knowledgeable and as fair a dealer/enthusiast as you will ever find. I bet you a $10 donation to the board that the gun sells for at least 95% of the asking price in the next 30 days. One thing I've learned in the past few years of building a Title II collection from scratch is that there is ALWAYS someone with a lot of money who won't miss a breath plunking down the change necessary to buy a gun like the one being offerred. Just because 99 other people wouldn't dream of paying that price, it only takes one who will. That, by definition, is "the market" and it's Steave's responsibility to his client to hit that mark. When I first saw this ad, I thought Steave was selling another certain Navy Colt I've had the privilege of fondling. http://www.machinegunbooks.com/forums/invboard1_1_2/upload/html/emoticons/wink.gif Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steave Posted October 14, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 14, 2006 (edited) Nope, Kyle, that gun is NOT for sale! This whole discussion is a moot point as the gun has been sold, pending funds; thanks! Edited October 14, 2006 by Steave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sig Posted October 14, 2006 Report Share Posted October 14, 2006 Steave Congrats to you, your seller and buyer. Hope that buyer joins us on the boards if he or she is not already a member. michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Posted October 16, 2006 Report Share Posted October 16, 2006 At last - I have a retirement account!! http://www.machinegunbooks.com/forums/invboard1_1_2/upload/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif Kevin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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