reconbob Posted October 20, 2018 Report Share Posted October 20, 2018 Posted by Bob for Doug. Doug is in Belize now and it looks like he has time to write some posts. The number hehas listed below is his standard Malibu California number but it will ring thru to Belize sofeel free to call. Begin Dougs Post: There are three types of grip mounts found on Thompson guns. They are 1) 1921, 2) 1928A1/M1 and 3) M1A1. The first two are dimensionally identical. They are a single part, gang machined from a plate. I refer to these as "1-piece" grip mounts. The only difference is that the 1921 has an upward bend at the front face of the receiver in order to increase the amount of interference with the barrel Forcing it downward to get it under the barrel creares the extra rigidity needed by the vertical foregrip. With the introduction of the WW2 Model 1928A1, the extra rigidity was no longer needed since only horizontal forearms were fitted to the guns. Therefore, the bend was eliminated. The Model M1A1 gun saw the introduction of, what I call, the 3-piece grip mount. It was meant to reduce the cost of manufacturing the grip mount by making the body out of flat, rectangular bar stock. The "tab", which is sandwiched between the barrel and receiver to prevent the mount from falling out of its receiver slot, was made as a rivet with the head of the "rivet" shaped like the original tab. The barrel support projection was also made in the form of a rivet. These two "rivets" required the body to be drilled in order to accept the "rivets". This worked OK for the projection because the drilled hole was at the front end of the body where there is little stress.The design diaster was that the hole for the tab rivet was right at the receiverface which is the exact location of the highest stress area of the grip mount. The result was that a downwad pull on the forearm sling swivel could cause thegrip mount to bend downward, taking the forearm with it and rendering the gun unserviceable. To remedy this situation, a barrel band was designed that enclosed the barrel and forearm, locking them together. The band was issued to field repair facilities for retrofit on guns that had the 3-piece grip mount before the grip mount failed. Once the grip mount had been bent, the only way to repair the gun was to remove the barrel in order to install another, hopefully 1-piece, grip mount. Finding one of the bands that was not already on a gun was very difficult.I have several original bands available for those who want an original band. But, because they are so rare and because I have the original drawing of the band, we made the tooling to manufacture the band. I still have available a quantity of the bands we manufactured for those of you who want to save money and not be able to tell the difference. There is no difference. However, the purpopse of this post was not top sell bands. I thought some of you would be interested in seeing the photo of the tooling required to manufacture the bands. The photo shows the original drawing, a new-made band and partially formed bands. It all goes into storage, at least for the time being. If you have any questions or comments, you can call me, Doug Richardson, 310-457-6400. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalbert Posted October 20, 2018 Report Share Posted October 20, 2018 But, because they are so rare and because I have the original drawing of the band, we made the tooling to manufacture the band. I still have available a quantity of the bands we manufactured for those of you who want to save money and not be able to tell the difference. There is no difference. It would be nice (and responsible to the Thompson collector community) if these were marked to indicate they are reproduction barrel bands. David Albertdalbert@sturmgewehr.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anjong-ni Posted October 20, 2018 Report Share Posted October 20, 2018 Love seeing production tooling! Thanks Doug and Bob.....Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bridgeport28A1 Posted October 21, 2018 Report Share Posted October 21, 2018 But, because they are so rare and because I have the original drawing of the band, we made the tooling to manufacture the band. I still have available a quantity of the bands we manufactured for those of you who want to save money and not be able to tell the difference. There is no difference. It would be nice (and responsible to the Thompson collector community) if these were marked to indicate they are reproduction barrel bands. David Albertdalbert@sturmgewehr.comIt would be nice to have them marked to identify them as reproduction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD. Posted October 21, 2018 Report Share Posted October 21, 2018 I am with dalbert and Bridgeport28A1 on marking reproduction items. Think of the havoc Gordon Herigstad did to the Thompson community by having spare part kit containers and long cleaning rods manufactured without any marking to indicate a modern day reproduction. I spoke to the manufacturer of the spare part kits and was told a mark could have easily been added to each kit during the manufacturing process at no additional cost. There is no doubt these two nicely made and durable reproduction items will cause problems for collectors and enthusiasts in the future. Something that could have easily been avoided! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paladin601 Posted October 21, 2018 Report Share Posted October 21, 2018 I love the Production thread, wish there were more of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
full auto 45 Posted October 21, 2018 Report Share Posted October 21, 2018 What price do you have for the original bands and then for the reproductions.I would be interested in an original. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reconbob Posted October 21, 2018 Author Report Share Posted October 21, 2018 For what its worth I don't think Doug is trying to mislead anyone. He habituallymarks his stuff with the Richardson "R". I have seen it on his receivers and especiallyhis beautiful M1921 actuators. I am sure he would mark these bands as well. Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adg105200 Posted October 22, 2018 Report Share Posted October 22, 2018 I didn't realize that they were rare it I'd have picked up a handful from Clemsford Militaria when they had a few months back. Andrew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD. Posted October 22, 2018 Report Share Posted October 22, 2018 Excellent point Bob! I noticed Gun Parts Corporation has Thompson barrel bands in stock. I have no idea about originality or reproduction. Price: $22.10 https://www.gunpartscorp.com/products/501280 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R67 Posted October 22, 2018 Report Share Posted October 22, 2018 How many TSMGs were fitted with bands before the end of WWII? I have not seen many photos of them in use during WWII, Korea, or Vietnam. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
full auto 45 Posted October 22, 2018 Report Share Posted October 22, 2018 How many TSMGs were fitted with bands before the end of WWII? I have not seen many photos of them in use during WWII, Korea, or Vietnam. Found this in a quick search.http://www.machinegunboards.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=12135 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
APEXgunparts Posted October 23, 2018 Report Share Posted October 23, 2018 APEX Gun Parts also has this barrel band listed, including the nut & screw.https://www.apexgunparts.com/machine-guns/sub-machine-guns/thompson-45-acp/thompson-m1a1-foregrip-reinforcing-band-with-screw-g.html Richard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R67 Posted October 23, 2018 Report Share Posted October 23, 2018 It seems that these bands are not rare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richard w. Posted October 23, 2018 Report Share Posted October 23, 2018 (edited) Watch out for the bands from Numrich. I bought one a few years ago and I think it may be an aftermarket copy of the original GI bands. The band is thinner and smaller than an original, and it sticks out like a sore thumb when installed. It looks and feels like something off a toy gun.(Came with rust blooms thrown in for free.) In the photos, there's a known original GI band on the left, and the band from Numrich on the right. http://www.fototime.com/AA295E267AEB50B/orig.jpg http://www.fototime.com/39FF8669A0E0E6B/orig.jpg http://www.fototime.com/208C514E2CE112D/orig.jpg Edited October 23, 2018 by richard w. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bridgeport28A1 Posted October 23, 2018 Report Share Posted October 23, 2018 APEX Gun Parts also has this barrel band listed, including the nut & screw. https://www.apexgunparts.com/machine-guns/sub-machine-guns/thompson-45-acp/thompson-m1a1-foregrip-reinforcing-band-with-screw-g.html Richard The reinforcing band pictured above by Apex Gun Parts does not have the small indentation usually observed on known USGI reinforcing bands. Any members have what they consider a legitimate USGI band without the small indentation protrusion on the side of the band? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bridgeport28A1 Posted October 27, 2018 Report Share Posted October 27, 2018 (edited) How many TSMGs were fitted with bands before the end of WWII? I have not seen many photos of them in use during WWII, Korea, or Vietnam. A quick look through The Thompson Submachine Gun Book by Tom Laemlein has three photographs of M1/M1A1 Thompsons with the metal band visible. All are located in the ETO. There are also several photos of M1/M1A1 Thompsons with tape wrapped around the barrel in the vicinity of where the reinforcing band would be located. Quite a few M1/M1A1 Thompsons with a protected L rear sights had a rear stock without the reinforcing crossbolt. A majority of the Thompsons with a protected L rear sight did have a rear stock with a crossbolt.All 1928 Thompson had a rear stock without a crossbolt when the rear stock was visible in the photograph. Edited October 27, 2018 by Bridgeport28A1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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