Anybody dealt with Autoweapons.com?

[buzz]

So since I started this thread on "Autoweapons" about two years ago...

 

- I emailed for a quote on a nice-looking M1 Thompson they had listed; got a quick reply that was

polite enough, but about $10K above what I eventually found one (original WW2 gun) for. Given the differential,

my judgement was that we were way too far apart to likely ever make a deal, so I didn't counter or

otherwise try to negotiate on that gun.

- I subsequently purchased one of the Integrally Suppressed Rugers ("Amphibian") from them, and have

to say that that transfer was handled quickly & professionally, and no problems (*gun now in my safe).

 

I would presume they cater to a clientele (not me!) that has soooo much money, that "$10K either way" is neither

here nor there... and that seems to be the way that most MG ownership is going... keep in mind we live in a

country where it is said that 63% of people couldn't cover an unexpected $500 debt...

(see-- https://www.forbes.com/sites/maggiemcgrath/2016/01/06/63-of-americans-dont-have-enough-savings-to-cover-a-500-emergency/#3dc7fd414e0d )

 

My $0.02...

 

That's fine, but there's never a reason to be rude in the manner described in this thread by some of the posters.

 

I've sold guns on gunbroker and dealt with plenty of people and never had to resort to acting like a jerk.

 

Rudeness is the way that weaklings imitate strength, I have no respect for it.

 

Those people will never get a penny from me and I am local to them.

Edited December 18, 2017 by buzz

[johnsonlmg41]

I've bought some items from him. He doesn't do much on the internet and doesn't sell to new people due to the immense amount of handholding and often poor information on the net where he's had "experts" calling him and telling him about stuff he actually has......and they have never seen.

It's not a business model for everyone, but he's been pretty successful and has rare stuff no one else offers. If you know this, are knowledgeable about the items, prices, and availability of certain things , you just call and pay the price and he's easy to deal with. If you call, don't know much, expect a free history lesson on the item, with no money or intent to buy, you are generally blown off in the same way you'd start reading the paper at a news stand downtown new York .

Understand he's a born and bred hardcore new York working guy. If you've ever been there or dealt with working people there, they have a certain dialect that most of the rest of the country considers rude, once you acclimate he's a pretty nice guy IMO. I believe the term is polarizing figure.

 

If you are an HK fanatic and you wanted a 416, odds are you have him to thank. Many dealers and 02/07's have done exactly the same thing and in reading those articles you guys are effectively merchants of death for dealing in hard to get high priced collectibles? The reality here is that 95% of you are not hard core collectors thus you don't see value in having a source for very rare items in the marketplace a phone call away. He's the go to guy for rare and collectible NFA items. If you want an uzi or MAC call someone else, if you want a real UZI you'd call him and pay for one the very rare transferables. If you don't understand what I just said and have to look it up on the web, then you're not going to want to call him.

[huggytree]

in my business i often can tell window shoppers and price shoppers and i try to get them off the phone as quickly as possible....with his business model its probably much easier...ask any questions and your not his customer.....ask where to send the check? and you are.....

[Petroleum 1]

Johnson...I was just asking for pricing on the provided link next to the item. No hand holding or questions. For some reason this person on the other end saw me posting as a newbie here and on the message boards and took liberty to rip me as a "tire kicker". As for your explanation of this person on the other end of my email as being a "hardcore" New York working guy that is no excuse for the way I was treated. I am a business owner myself and grew up very close to where mr hardcore is from so trust me I know " these people" intimately. Vinny

[huggytree]

at some point you get tired of customers....he is at that point maybe...he hates people? and dealing with them.....i deal with 5-10 people a day and some days i love my customers, some days i absolutely hate them....business hardens you....over the years i see it happening to me also...in 10 more years ill be like him maybe

Edited December 18, 2017 by huggytree

[Petroleum 1]

Huggy...also if "this person" is the owner then he is facing some stiff jail time very soon for his creative gun dealing so possibly a reason for the quick temper.

[ppgcowboy]

He is an idiot, he says price on request and then jumps your case for asking.

[buzz]

I've bought some items from him. He doesn't do much on the internet and doesn't sell to new people due to the immense amount of handholding and often poor information on the net where he's had "experts" calling him and telling him about stuff he actually has......and they have never seen.

It's not a business model for everyone, but he's been pretty successful and has rare stuff no one else offers. If you know this, are knowledgeable about the items, prices, and availability of certain things , you just call and pay the price and he's easy to deal with. If you call, don't know much, expect a free history lesson on the item, with no money or intent to buy, you are generally blown off in the same way you'd start reading the paper at a news stand downtown new York .

Understand he's a born and bred hardcore new York working guy. If you've ever been there or dealt with working people there, they have a certain dialect that most of the rest of the country considers rude, once you acclimate he's a pretty nice guy IMO. I believe the term is polarizing figure.

 

If you are an HK fanatic and you wanted a 416, odds are you have him to thank. Many dealers and 02/07's have done exactly the same thing and in reading those articles you guys are effectively merchants of death for dealing in hard to get high priced collectibles? The reality here is that 95% of you are not hard core collectors thus you don't see value in having a source for very rare items in the marketplace a phone call away. He's the go to guy for rare and collectible NFA items. If you want an uzi or MAC call someone else, if you want a real UZI you'd call him and pay for one the very rare transferables. If you don't understand what I just said and have to look it up on the web, then you're not going to want to call him.

 

 

Come on. You've got to be kidding.

 

I have looked at his website dozens of times over the years and what he usually has for sale is the same exact normal stuff that Ruben has for sale or what you see on gunbroker or the auction sites like Julia's.

 

Go look right now. He has Reisings, M1 carbines, various MACs, a couple of M16s, some WWI and WWII crew type MGs.

 

I see nothing all that exotic. Every gun on his site I have seen on gunbroker before.

 

Even if he did have incredibly exotic hardware instead of a bunch of M16s and MACs, there is NO EXCUSE for his rudeness.

 

The idea that you're supposed to pay a 25% or 50% premium over high retail and then ask no questions is flat out absurd.

 

Okay, so anyway....

 

Suppose I want to buy that 1928A1 that he has for sale. It's probably worth around $25k or so. Maybe you'd pay more like $28k if you were buying from Ruben.

 

So he's going to tell me the gun is $32k and I can't ask any questions or he'll tell me to go eff myself and bang the phone down?

 

No thanks, you can have my share of that.

[huggytree]

he has LOTS of nice Thompsons, etc.....anything you want, he has it and it looks VERY NICE....he is a higher end dealer....nicer stuff than Ruben....Ruben only has refinished thompsons....right now he has 1...autoweapons probably has 4-6 of them....most original

 

i think he has 1 of everything......you want it, he has it

[buzz]

Huggy...also if "this person" is the owner then he is facing some stiff jail time very soon for his creative gun dealing so possibly a reason for the quick temper.

 

 

The reason for his quick temper is because the gun collecting fraternity constantly make excuses for these idiots.

 

There are some horrible vendors and gunsmiths out there that we just put up with. in any other business, they'd be out of work.

 

Like this case. Look at this thread.

 

Now we're suggesting that his unbelievably awful behavior is because he's a New Yorker or because getting nabbed breaking the law put him in a sour mood.

 

Come on already.

 

This is literally battered wife syndrome. "Oh, Freddy wouldn't slap me around so much but his boss at work treats him so badly that he takes it out on me. Please officer don't arrest him, he really loves me deep down."

 

The people who are rude are only rude because they can get away with it. It's that simple.

 

You think the guy from autoweapons walks into a corner bar full of roughnecks and starts telling people to go eff themselves? Of course not, because he'd walk out with no teeth left in his head.

 

But we put up with it because we're extra nice people. That's the answer to the riddle. In this thread, I have learned that you guys are really nice people.

 

This thread amounts to a bunch of guys reporting HORRIBLE behavior from a rude jerk and other guys trying as hard as they can to excuse it.

 

There are plenty of dealers out there who are extremely courteous. There is no reason at all for rudeness.

Edited December 18, 2017 by buzz

[buzz]

he has LOTS of nice Thompsons, etc.....anything you want, he has it and it looks VERY NICE....he is a higher end dealer....nicer stuff than Ruben....Ruben only has refinished thompsons....right now he has 1...autoweapons probably has 4-6 of them....most original

 

i think he has 1 of everything......you want it, he has it

 

 

Who cares if he has nice guns? What on earth does that have to do with his behavior?

 

I work in heavy construction, including in NYC, with lots of alpha dogs and lots of lawyers and lawsuits and millions upon millions of dollars changing hands and if I treated a potential customer with this kind of rudeness I would be fired on the spot.

 

One of our members here on this site recently inquired about a price on a gun and was treated with extreme rudeness.

 

There's no excuse for it. Period.

 

And on top of it, the jerk in question is ready for jail time.

 

Come on.

[83Baron]

 

 

Huggy...also if "this person" is the owner then he is facing some stiff jail time very soon for his creative gun dealing so possibly a reason for the quick temper.

 

 

The reason for his quick temper is because the gun collecting fraternity constantly make excuses for these idiots.

 

There are some horrible vendors and gunsmiths out there that we just put up with. in any other business, they'd be out of work.

 

Like this case. Look at this thread.

 

Now we're suggesting that his unbelievably awful behavior is because he's a New Yorker or because getting nabbed breaking the law put him in a sour mood.

 

Come on already.

 

This is literally battered wife syndrome. "Oh, Freddy wouldn't slap me around so much but his boss at work treats him so badly that he takes it out on me. Please officer don't arrest him, he really loves me deep down."

 

The people who are rude are only rude because they can get away with it. It's that simple.

 

You think the guy from autoweapons walks into a corner bar full of roughnecks and starts telling people to go eff themselves? Of course not, because he'd walk out with no teeth left in his head.

 

But we put up with it because we're extra nice people. That's the answer to the riddle.

 

This thread amounts to a bunch of guys reporting HORRIBLE behavior from a rude jerk and other guys trying as hard as they can to excuse it.

 

There are plenty of dealers out there who are extremely courteous. There is no reason at all for rudeness.

Absolutely. Ive come across all types of people as well, in business, etc. and many that ask questions have more than enough money to pay whatever their asking price is, its just a matter of if they see the value in doing so. Its not called old money for nothing.

[Petroleum 1]

Yup and this tire kicker bought 2 guns spent $50k since the nasty emails too. Oh well...it really upset me because this person made it seem like the people on this site and message boards were laughing at me for being a newbie and that there is no room for f...ing people in this hobby like me.

[83Baron]

Yup and this tire kicker bought 2 guns spent $50k since the nasty emails too. Oh well...it really upset me because this person made it seem like the people on this site and message boards were laughing at me for being a newbie and that there is no room for f...ing people in this hobby like me.

Dont let it get you down Vinny. They dont deserve your business, and with that approach and mindset to customers chances are they wont be around forever.

[azboater]

Yup and this tire kicker bought 2 guns spent $50k since the nasty emails too. Oh well...it really upset me because this person made it seem like the people on this site and message boards were laughing at me for being a newbie and that there is no room for f...ing people in this hobby like me.

Hey Vin,

I am looking forward to shooting with you!

F**k Him

[Petroleum 1]

Same here Nick...LOL!!!

[buzz]

Yup and this tire kicker bought 2 guns spent $50k since the nasty emails too. Oh well...it really upset me because this person made it seem like the people on this site and message boards were laughing at me for being a newbie and that there is no room for f...ing people in this hobby like me.

 

 

Yeah, there's no room for guys like us in this hobby.

 

I decided to buy a Thompson one day while watching a gangster movie. Knew nothing at all about them. Bought two of them from a dealer about two months later.

 

The dealer was pleasant and seemed very happy to take that bank check from me.

 

He didn't seem to feel the need to tell me to eff off. Imagine that.

[buzz]

By the way, I did not mean to fault anyone in who responded to this thread.

 

Some of you are just real even tempered guys, you don't get annoyed with rude people.

[Black River Militaria CII]

I repaired a couple of his guns a few years ago and talked with him at KC prior to that. Because he opened up a new MG business with a lot of MGs listed, and had a following of friends who thought he was God himself, many people were suddenly very impressed with him. Nothing he offered was unusual or rare, same now. In due course he pissed off a lot of people by delivering vintage MGs that were in a lot worse condition that they appeared to be in the pics. He blamed the customers! I repaired some of these guns because one of the buyers were already my customers.

At one point he did have one "rare" MG listed for sale, which was offered for a very long time with an extended description and supporting affidavits. It was a German Maxim MG08/18, the air-cooled version of the watercooled MG08/15. Few were made.

He claimed in his ad that it had been confirmed as an authentic gun by Bill Vallerand, a longtime friend of mine now deceased, who was extremely knowledgeable about vintage MGs. If Bill had seen the gun he would have pointed out that it was a copy built from an 08/15. This was easily determined from the pics. Also, unknown to Vahan, the self proclaimed well informed MG expert, there are no registered examples or examples at all, of any 08/18s in the US. I recall that Stan Andrewski's name was also invoked as supporting the premise that the gun was authentic. Stan is also a longtime acquaintance of mine, and I don't know if he actually believed the gun was an authentic 08/18 or not. It was a fake, but was never revealed in the ad as such.

There were other MGs incorrectly identified in varieties of ways as time went on, but Vahan was indifferent to advice or correction by those whom he designated as 'idiots" and "newbies" regardless of whether they were correct or not. I still get a few calls about his offerings, but hardly any compared to when he first came onto the scene with a completely unknown, unproven, yet fabulous 90 day wonder reputation.

Having a large inventory of MGs offered for sale and pictured is very exciting, as it should be, and in the world of private MG collecting elevates the owner to celebrity status. All it represents is money when there is no understanding, enthusiasm, familiarity with the mechanics, interest in and pursuit of knowledge of the history of manufacture and use of the guns, and no immersion into the depth of the history of these guns. Just money and hype. And nothing rare, or even moderately rare, ever, that can't be found elsewhere.

In the 1970s and into the eighties there were offerings from large inventories that did include really rare and unusual MGs including J. Curtis Earl, the most notorious, Dolf Goldsmith's partnership, R.J. Perry, Fred Rexer, Roger Cox of Law enforcement Ord, and and quite a few others, all of whom had tables at shows and would have incredible displays of MGs. Perry sometimes offered working prototype MGs, for instance offering at one time one of the McClean system prototype MGs that evolved into the Lewis gun, or had production numbers 1,2, 3 etc of different MGs, Colt R75s and Monitors, etc, etc. These MGs were expensive for the time for sure, but there they were for sale. Dealer's these days with large inventories are Chevy dealers in comparison, in my opinion.

I am not talking about private collectors here, but about dealers, just to be clear. It takes all kinds but I have watched quite a few dealers come and go over the years who have been rude, ignorant of the products they sell, unethical and deceitful in their business practices and there is no defense of such behavior. I bought my first registered MG from J.C. Earl in 1970 and got taken to the cleaners. Having bought his fabulous brochures, an they were marketing gems, and already owning a few DEWATs, I was ripe for the picking. I knew of only a few dealers in the business scattered around the country and never thought to ask for references. I was overjoyed to purchase that MG from Earl, a beatup Colt overstamp, but wised up to the nature of the MG "game" pronto. No regrets, certainly, as I love the hobby and the business and count myself extremely lucky to be a part of it.

FWIW

[Sandman1957]

Buzz you are absolutely correct. I really, really try to be considerate now. If you look, most of my posts are edited by me after I decide to make it a little better or whatever. In my former life I was not very nice. Not hateful, never needed to be. But if the "Werewolf" ever needed to come out ,he did. Have you ever done things where you sort of see yourself doing it, and your mind is a little detached? I was honored to serve with real Hero's. Our saying was walk the walk don't talk the talk. We had Cowboys and quiet professionals. The cowboys wanted all the badges and ribbons. The professionals just wanted to get their guys home alive. He would not have lasted 5 minutes in a fire fight.

[johnsonlmg41]

Everyone certainly has an opinion and I've heard a number of stories about just about every dealer, some well founded, others marginal. Not saying I disagree with many of the observations, just offered up some experiences and thoughts. Not my particular business model, but if a guy can make it work my hat is off to them.

 

Respectfully Vinny, you are a new guy, need hand holding (which is why you have asked a ton of questions here. Nothing wrong with that BTW) and unfortunately 50K is not that big of a deal these days. You have kicked around a lot of guns in the past few months without buying which is again probably good for you as folks here offer up a lot of good advice in most circumstances to the best of their ability. Did you ask for references on Dan?

[TD.]

Plus 1 for the above post by Black River Militaria CII - well worth reading twice!

[Petroleum 1]

Plus 1 for the above post by Black River Militaria CII - well worth reading twice!

+1

[fifthmdec]

Bob... interesting as usual...

 

Years ago, I inquired about a Reising M50 that was advertised as a M55, dressed up with a 55 stock. Got the treatment as echoed in this thread.

 

No need to be an elitist AHole...

[colt21a]

There is a whole host of names I had on the tommy gun news flyer 'The Quest" back around 1991 or so. and I looked at it the other day half from the list are already gone to the feast table at Valhalla, Probably still talking about Colt values and parts kits. And who had the Best Thompson. The party we discussed here will never make that grade.

 

Colt 21A Ron