Cleaning, etc. Advice

[morke]

I recently acquired a 1921AC Thompson. I collect other historical Americana machines and artifacts (e.g. antque slot machines) and I've always been intrigued by the Thompson's iconic place in American history. I finally gave in to my collecting muse. First gun I've ever owned, but now it seems there will be more...

 

Anyway, the gun is in excellent shape and has been well-cared-for. It is very clean and well-oiled.

 

My questions (sorry -- newbie here) are:

 

What type of cloths/oil should I use for the exterior metal.

Same for the internal parts.

What kind of tool works best for bore and breach cleaning -- I've seen brushes, ropes, you name it.

 

And finally -- should I shoot it? What are the chances that shooting it will degrade it's value.

[TD.]

morke,

Congratulations on your 1921AC. I assume you mean a Colt’s Thompson.

 

May I suggest my new book, An Amateur’s Guide for the Colt’s Thompson Submachine Gun, with a dedicated chapter about shooting an original Colt’s. It is available on Amazon.com with a “Look inside” feature. NOTE:DO NOT SHOOT YOUR 1921AC WITH AN ORIGINAL COLT’S ACTUATOR.

 

There is also a chapter about caring for the wood on a Colt’s.

 

Regarding cleaning, I am old school. Hoppes has always worked best for me!

[Rimcrew]

I can highly recommend TD's book! I just bought my first Thompson, and this book was invaluable in helping me every step of the way.

 

Get it, you won't be sorry.

 

Congrats on the Colt. Please post pictures when you can.

[morke]

Thanks -- just ordered the book. It looks very helpful. Yes, it is a Colt and all-original it seems, although I'm definitely unqualified to judge that.

 

The internal parts are all in excellent condition.

 

How do you determine if a barrel is bulged? The index mark on the barrel lines up precisely with the mark on the receiver, for what that's worth.

 

Why should it not be shot with an original Colt actuator, and how can I tell?

 

This gun has been fired before, to the best of my knowledge, but not sure if any pieces have been replaced or are repros.

 

Thanks!

[mnshooter]

Pictures, please.

[ppgcowboy]

Ears on the actuator can break and severely diminish its value. Get GI parts for the upper parts, and I would even get a 28 trigger housing and not use the 21 housing. Hen replace the wood to protect the original wood from further dings if any. When you display it, put the original stuff back on. The barrel will be debated if you intend to shoot it. I am still not understanding how well the witness mark will line up if the barrel is swapped.

[morke]

I'll post some pics soon. Thanks for the advice. In the mean time I'll rent the TSMG at the range to shoot. It's a 1928 A1 they claim.

[morke]

I think ppgcowboy's advice is good but by the time I replace all the parts with those suggested would it be easier to look for a shooting grade gun and only fire that? I suppose licensing issues come into play with complete gun vs. parts.

 

That said, is it out-of-bounds to ask for recommendations on reputable parts suppliers?

[TD.]

morke,

Thank you for purchasing my book. It will answer all your questions multiple times in multiple chapters. Study the pictures and captions. Given the price of my book versus the price of a Colt’s, I suggest you use a highlighter to mark the sections of interest.

 

I would not shoot your Colt’s until you really understand the product. I look forward to seeing pictures of your Colt’s.

[cbmott]

I think ppgcowboy's advice is good but by the time I replace all the parts with those suggested would it be easier to look for a shooting grade gun and only fire that? I suppose licensing issues come into play with complete gun vs. parts.

 

That said, is it out-of-bounds to ask for recommendations on reputable parts suppliers?

The FAQ section can answer a lot of questions and has links as well. Here’s a few links to get you started:

https://www.tommyguncollectibles.com/

 

https://www.gunpartscorp.com/

 

https://www.ima-usa.com/

 

https://www.apexgunparts.com/machine-guns/sub-machine-guns/thompson-45-acp.html?p=3&product_list_limit=56&utm_campaign=Standard+Newsletter+12-6-18&utm_content=Thompson+SMG+Parts+++More+at+APEX%21&utm_medium=email&utm_source=Newsletter

 

https://www.robertrtg.com/store/pc/showsearchresults.asp?pageStyle=H&resultCnt=&keyword=Thompson

 

Forum members will also post items for sale with the moderator David’s permission.

[ppgcowboy]

You will be around 1000 for the parts not including a barrel and swap.

[morke]

Pics

 

Overall it's mostly in great shape. Some scratches on receiver (any recommendations on how to make them less visible?

 

Actuator looks like it could be original Colt. All other parts seem original.

 

[Colt Chopper]

Very nice, Congrats !

[Rimcrew]

Looks great to me. Congrats!

[gijive]

Nice looking gun. Yes, the actuator is the original type and no, you do not want to shoot the gun using the original. Get a WWII actuator, have it cut down and use that along with a WWII bolt. Paul Krogh (PK) periodically make a run of cut down 1921 style actuators but you have to send him one to get on the list. He also offers a hybrid pilot and buffer system and offers reproduction 1921 type springs. I have used his parts many times and they work fine. Save the originals for display.

[colt21a]

That is the gun that Fred sold way back when as a cased set for $15 grand. I checked it out at the time on his counter when he took the pics for the shotgun news ad.{It was one he told me after over a 100 of them he should have kept}. was real nice and all original including the case drums and the mags and Rod. Was gun stated to be at scene when they got Pretty Boy.

 

And my opinion run a mag thru it clean it and oil and put away.... to say you shot some history....They have now become WALL ART just to look and admire.

 

RON K.

[morke]

Yes, it's the notoriously reputed and debated Pretty Boy Floyd gun. The story is certainly not proven beyond doubt, but some of the facts are close enough that some believe it was at least on the mission to kill him. To me it doesn't matter--it's a nice gun. The gun commanded a premium price due to the "story" but not as much as anticipated, and from what I can tell not too much more than a gun of this originality and rarity would bring. I know: "buy the gun, not the story."

 

Ron: when would that have been when Fred sold it?

 

I plan to follow the advice of this board and not fire it without changing out some of the original parts for less valuable ones, in case something goes amiss!

 

Thanks for your help. I'll get a list of proposed replacement parts for it and run it by you guys to make sure what I'm doing will work. Then I'll probably fire it very occasionally.

 

KM

[Bridgeport28A1]

Congratulation on your first firearm being a Colt 1921AC, my first was a Daisy 1894. Opposite ends of the spectrum.

[morke]

Bridgeport28A1:

 

Thanks. Yes, it's a bit over-the-top for a first gun but I collect and restore other antique machines and artifacts. I'm also a mechanical engineer and warfare machinery is something i have worked on professionally in the past. I've always been interested in the Thompson but always figured it would be impossible to acquire. I found out it wasn't that hard, at least in my state, so finally pulled the trigger (pun intended).

 

Being a collector I have now been bitten by the gun (especially antique and interesting) bug and if history repeats I'll probably pick up more as time goes on.

[colt21a]

Probably around 1990 or so. At last when i went to his place in Bloomington, I did a Ton of business with Fred. and was always helping him with the Thompson's The Mason city gun came thru Fred to me two times. What a tale on that one.it is you're gun and you paid the cash.So of course you can do as you please, i would keep it as a lil Piece of History and not change a part or a barrel on it.As i remarked don't mess up a true honest gun.

 

even Reed Knight tends not to blast off his original Stoners anymore.And not too sure how many Colt Monitors Visit knob creek for a 10,000 round shootout.

 

Enjoy as you do. You don't need a gun forum to tell you that And i am sure you already know that.Welcome to the forum

 

HAVE A GOOD 2020. RON K.

[lightguy]

I'm terrified of corrosion, pits, fingerprint oil etc so coat all the internals, bore and externals with birchwood casey gun grease.

I take off the sling swivels, buttplate etc as well and coat the undersides when buying a gun..

You would be amazed at whats hiding under that stuff.

 

Wipe off the exterior and run a gag through the bore before shooting. Internals can stay coated for the amount of shooting I do.

I cant fathom people shooting a gun and not cleaning it afterwards each time.

Pops taught me good

 

https://www.amazon.com/Birchwood-Casey-1003530-Universal-Grease/dp/B003ITB8NS/ref=sr_1_2?dchild=1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIjMzRoLze5gIVEfDACh0hDQrJEAAYASAAEgJrLfD_BwE&hvadid=178125412920&hvdev=c&hvlocphy=9027199&hvnetw=g&hvpos=1t1&hvqmt=e&hvrand=12426133088065113492&hvtargid=kwd-155247975636&hydadcr=9688_9896365&keywords=birchwood+casey+gun+grease&qid=1577746685&sr=8-2

 

If something cant be disassembled and there is a metal to metal gap soak the seam with Rem-oil until it penetrates.

Edited December 30, 2019 by lightguy

[ppgcowboy]

I sure hope refinishing not part of the plan. Consider those scratches part of its history.

[morke]

I sure hope refinishing not part of the plan. Consider those scratches part of its history.

 

Heck no -- I wouldn't try any refinishing of any kind. I was thinking of an oil, grease or wax that would protect and also hide the scratches a bit. Lightguy's recommendation of the Birchwood Casey grease sounds good -- reviews say it gives a luster to the metal that I'm thinking plain oil won't.

 

As far as corrosion, I am concerned about that and will keep all metal oiled or greased. I will probably put something on the wood on occaison to keep it from drying out. I use Howard's Feed n Wax on my other antiques and it works great. Contains Caranuba and Beeswax.

[TD.]

morke,

Please dont do anything to the wood until you read that chapter in my book. Think linseed oil. Period.

 

Take it slow. You do not want to devalue that nice Colts. In addition, think about joining one or both of the Thompson associations and attending a show and shot in 2020. I guarantee a great time.

[morke]

TD and all,

 

I found the Knobby Creek KY shoot coming up this Spring. I'm trying to find clubs or shows more local to me (in NC) but haven't had much luck yet. Anyone know of any or where I should look to find some?

 

I looked found the TATA website and plan to join. I think there was another association mentioned as well...

 

The TATA website has some links to other sites with message boards and lists of "approved" dealers. There are some in NC and I might take the gun by them if only to get more advice. Nothing like an in-person discussion.

 

I will continue to drink from the proverbial firehose.