Got Uzi Posted February 1 Report Share Posted February 1 This popped up on Gunjoker last night and I emailed the seller to confirm that it is indeed a transferable. Most the time there is an import stamp like that on the gun, it’s a pre sample. Anyone else seen a transferable Thompson with import marks? https://www.gunbroker.com/item/1033782126 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Centrifugal Arms Posted February 1 Report Share Posted February 1 Unlikely to be transferable and definitely not transferable just because he received it on a F4. Coincidentally, I'm in Reno and also know these guys pretty well. If you are interested in this gun I can run down there and have a look at the gun and paperwork. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NFA amnesty Posted February 1 Report Share Posted February 1 (edited) From a quick internet search, looks like the importer was old armory Sacramento. Guess they imported a lot of weapons back in the 60's, 70's and 80's. Here is an old post on the web about them. They imported quite a few thompson submachine guns per the statement below. "The armory had a fair size C&R and Class III import buisness as well. Broomhandles, lugers, swedish mausers, johnson auto rifle, smles, berrettas, colt 1900, 02 and 03 you name it they imported it. Their " backyard sales" and Dealer warehouse were legendary. Mausers by the pile, lugers 20 to a "chain", big boxs full of bayonets. Will always be impressed by the sight of pallet loads of UD and thompson submachine guns". Edited February 2 by NFA amnesty 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
full auto 45 Posted February 2 Report Share Posted February 2 Would be worth flying to Reno to inspect it and see paperwork at that price. Does it look funny behind the ejector or just worn bad. Reweld? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Got Uzi Posted February 2 Author Report Share Posted February 2 I might be interested in it but I’d lay money that it’s a pre sample gun. I tried to tell them just because it’s on a Form 4 doesn’t mean it’s transferable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Got Uzi Posted February 2 Author Report Share Posted February 2 Just worn not welded. The color is too even. Had it been welded you’d see it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangeRanger Posted February 2 Report Share Posted February 2 FWIW my parkerized M1 has a similar color change in the same area. NOT a reweld. I think that the difference in cross sectional area caused a difference in temperature which in turn caused the phosphate to react a bit differently. Perhaps the same thing happened with blueing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSMGguy Posted February 2 Report Share Posted February 2 13 hours ago, Got Uzi said: ...just because it’s on a Form 4 doesn’t mean it’s transferable. Not throwing any rocks here but why's that? If the seller has an approved form 4, then the evidence would seem to say that the gun IS transferable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Got Uzi Posted February 2 Author Report Share Posted February 2 A form 4 is used to transfer out a pre sample if the person has dropped his or her SOT....my sole prop SOT is going to go away and I'll be keepng my pre samples....when I go to sell them someday, they will go out on a Form 4.....so your argument is invalid to instantly say if it has a Form 4 then it must be transferable. Its not uncommon to see a pre sample Form 4 with the "restricted sales sample" stamp left off and then one or two transfers later it comes to light and then the last guy holding the bag is screwed for a the amount of money he paid for something that it wasn't 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxfaxdude Posted February 2 Report Share Posted February 2 (edited) 16 hours ago, Centrifugal Arms said: Unlikely to be transferable and definitely not transferable just because he received it on a F4. Coincidentally, I'm in Reno and also know these guys pretty well. If you are interested in this gun I can run down there and have a look at the gun and paperwork. Definitely interested...if you're in the neighborhood. Seller could supply a redacted Form 4 which might tell more. If imported before the 1968 GCA, maybe fully transferable. Or maybe registered some other way as a fully transferable. Stranger things have happened....especially with the ATF. Edited February 2 by maxfaxdude Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Centrifugal Arms Posted February 2 Report Share Posted February 2 1 hour ago, maxfaxdude said: Definitely interested...if you're in the neighborhood. Seller could supply a redacted Form 4 which might tell more. If imported before the 1968 GCA, maybe fully transferable. Or maybe registered some other way as a fully transferable. Stranger things have happened....especially with the ATF. I spoke with the owner last night, the unredacted F4 doesn't show any restrictions. The gun in question was purchased with two other Thompsons all of which are supposedly transferable. While I have little doubt the other two are, this one I'm much less confident about. That concern is further validated by the fact that the previous owner was an ex FFL/SOT so it definitely leaves to door open to the pre sample possibility. From the sounds of it, they have a copy of the previous transfer form for this gun, he was going to dig that up and start by taking a closer look at it (didn't recall if it was F3 or F4). I'll be in their neighborhood next Monday, happy to swing in and have a closer look at what's he's found by then, will PM you my contact info. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Got Uzi Posted February 2 Author Report Share Posted February 2 I'd like to know as well as I am watching this and might bid on it if it does turn out to be the pre sample I am willing to lay money that it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Got Uzi Posted February 2 Author Report Share Posted February 2 Just looked at the listing and I'm not bidding now.....its at $20K so he better hope and pray it is indeed a transferable ot hes gonna have to close the listing and redo it as its over pre sample money LOL love the uneducated bidders who don't stop and ask qustions but take things at face value. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colt21a Posted February 2 Report Share Posted February 2 (edited) I have a post sample and a presample paperwork around someplace no stamp in red or black showing restrictions.and one AK-74 FROM 1998 THAT SHOWED FORM 3 NO RESTRICT. And when i retired from the bizz heck now 14 years. they left me with a posty Bulgarian RPK-74.{ i chopped it and had made into semi auto}it resides in a collection now in texas one of 2 in the u.s. i still have the original trunnion block and paper. so yes post, pre, and trans, mistakes get made. like Vollmers trans stoner outfit that became pre sample when he sold it.AND MANY OTHER MIX UPS AND SCREW UPS. Transfer it and see what happens... Edited February 2 by colt21a Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Got Uzi Posted February 2 Author Report Share Posted February 2 I can tell you I wouldn’t want to follow “transfer and see what happens” then be holding the bag for a gun that’s not worth what I paid for it. But I guess some people have enough money to gamble like that. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NFA amnesty Posted February 2 Report Share Posted February 2 I would gamble on it if the price was 10k or less but not at the current price level. So guys what were the rules in the 60's regarding importing machine guns and registering them? I have heard folks talk about inter-arms importing and selling machine guns in the day to the civilian market. Could this have also been registered in the early or mid 60's? just asking as I have heard a lot of different stories on this topic regarding importation and Form 4's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1gewehr Posted February 3 Report Share Posted February 3 Prior to the 1968 GCA, machine guns could be imported and transferred to individuals. But, that $200 transfer tax was a LOT of money back then! Think of what $200 ounces of silver is worth today, and that's what the real value of $200 was back then. Todays spot is $22.65/ounce/ so the $200 tax then was equal to about $4530 in today's worthless, inflated Federal Reserve Notes. That's why so many machine guns were de-milled and sold as wall hangers. The attached ad shows an MP40 for $49.95, equal to $1131 in todays dollar. So, paying ANOTHER $4530 just to transfer the gun to a buyer if it was working was a non-starter for importers. Later, when the dollar was sufficiently inflated that $200 wasn't quite such a huge bite, importing of machine guns was more tightly controlled by the 1968 GCA creating 'Sales Samples', then the 1986 Hughes amendment practically killed it altogether. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NFA amnesty Posted February 3 Report Share Posted February 3 Best explanation I have ever had on this subject. That makes perfect sense. Thank you for sharing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bug Posted February 3 Report Share Posted February 3 So what did I miss? I don't see any explanation but the gun is currently listed at $10,024.00. Which is right in presample land. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank Iannamico Posted February 3 Report Share Posted February 3 I have a pre-May UZI that has no restriction stamps on the form. It had none on the previous form as well. It came from a dealer who thought it was transferable because the form was not stamped, he sold it to a non-SOT customer, and ATF denied the transfe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Got Uzi Posted February 3 Author Report Share Posted February 3 Then someone canceled a bid or something as it was just over $20k last night. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillinBama Posted February 3 Report Share Posted February 3 FWIW I have a M3A1 that came to me as transferable on a form 4 but I boughtbit as a pre sample. No restrictions listed but I bet NFA won't allow it to transfer to an individual. But if anyone is willing to gamble..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSMGguy Posted February 3 Report Share Posted February 3 18 hours ago, colt21a said: Transfer it and see what happens... I'd suggest that's already happened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bug Posted February 3 Report Share Posted February 3 4 hours ago, bug said: So what did I miss? I don't see any explanation but the gun is currently listed at $10,024.00. Which is right in presample land. Now I see it in Bid history. There was a bid retraction at around 2 AM today, "at sellers request" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colt Chopper Posted February 3 Report Share Posted February 3 $500. shipping, I think that's a new track record !!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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